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tony
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Posted: Fri Sep 7th, 2007 06:01 pm |
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| I am a Florida resident that has punchiest a gun for my protection. I have been charged with open carry of a firearm 790.053. The situation is I had guest visiting with children and did not fell comfortable leaving my gun at home. Did not have my license yet so could not conceal my firearm, so I unload my gun place it in a holster and carry it to my car, place it in the glove box and drive away. Ten minutes later a police officer pulls me over with four other cars to assist in a takedown. Now I have been charged with open carry of a firearm. So how can I do this, if I conceal the gun I will be committing a felony and if I don’t it is a misdemeanor? How do I get my gun from my house to my car without becoming a criminal? The important part the kids are safe at my house! There is a level of responsibility in being a gun owner, and I thought that was me.
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ralphb72
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Posted: Fri Sep 7th, 2007 06:20 pm |
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| That sux, I'm not in Florida but I take it glove box carry is legal? In that case, couldn't you put it in a lockable case, unloaded and put it in your trunk? Or just put it in the case until you get in your car?
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rady8um
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Sep 7th, 2007 08:21 pm |
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tony wrote: I am a Florida resident that has punchiest a gun for my protection. I have been charged with open carry of a firearm 790.053. The situation is I had guest visiting with children and did not fell comfortable leaving my gun at home. Did not have my license yet so could not conceal my firearm, so I unload my gun place it in a holster and carry it to my car, place it in the glove box and drive away. Ten minutes later a police officer pulls me over with four other cars to assist in a takedown. Now I have been charged with open carry of a firearm. So how can I do this, if I conceal the gun I will be committing a felony and if I don’t it is a misdemeanor? How do I get my gun from my house to my car without becoming a criminal? The important part the kids are safe at my house! There is a level of responsibility in being a gun owner, and I thought that was me.
According to OCDO travel map, OC in a glove box is legal. Did they charge you with OC because of carrying it to your car? Is OC legal on your own property in FLA? Sounds like you need to talk a lawyer.
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Mike
Super Moderator
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Posted: Fri Sep 7th, 2007 08:37 pm |
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| This is why we need to de-criminalize open carry in FL and the other 5 states!
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Reverend73
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Fri Sep 7th, 2007 08:38 pm |
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OC is legal on your own property in FL. Glovebox carry is legal as well. You need to talk to a lawyer, because unless you aren't telling us something, you did nothing wrong
Applicable laws
790.053 Open carrying of weapons.--
(1) Except as otherwise provided by law and in subsection (2), it is unlawful for any person to openly carry on or about his or her person any firearm or electric weapon or device.
(2) A person may openly carry, for purposes of lawful self-defense:
(a) A self-defense chemical spray.
(b) A nonlethal stun gun or dart-firing stun gun or other nonlethal electric weapon or device that is designed solely for defensive purposes.
(3) Any person violating this section commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
790.25 Lawful ownership, possession, and use of firearms and other weapons.--
(3) LAWFUL USES.--The provisions of ss. 790.053 and 790.06 do not apply in the following instances, and, despite such sections, it is lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes:
(a) Members of the Militia, National Guard, Florida State Defense Force, Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps, Coast Guard, organized reserves, and other armed forces of the state and of the United States, when on duty, when training or preparing themselves for military duty, or while subject to recall or mobilization;
(b) Citizens of this state subject to duty in the Armed Forces under s. 2, Art. X of the State Constitution, under chapters 250 and 251, and under federal laws, when on duty or when training or preparing themselves for military duty;
(c) Persons carrying out or training for emergency management duties under chapter 252;
(d) Sheriffs, marshals, prison or jail wardens, police officers, Florida highway patrol officers, game wardens, revenue officers, forest officials, special officers appointed under the provisions of chapter 354, and other peace and law enforcement officers and their deputies and assistants and full-time paid peace officers of other states and of the Federal Government who are carrying out official duties while in this state;
(e) Officers or employees of the state or United States duly authorized to carry a concealed weapon;
(f) Guards or messengers of common carriers, express companies, armored car carriers, mail carriers, banks, and other financial institutions, while actually employed in and about the shipment, transportation, or delivery of any money, treasure, bullion, bonds, or other thing of value within this state;
(g) Regularly enrolled members of any organization duly authorized to purchase or receive weapons from the United States or from this state, or regularly enrolled members of clubs organized for target, skeet, or trap shooting, while at or going to or from shooting practice; or regularly enrolled members of clubs organized for modern or antique firearms collecting, while such members are at or going to or from their collectors' gun shows, conventions, or exhibits;
(h) A person engaged in fishing, camping, or lawful hunting or going to or returning from a fishing, camping, or lawful hunting expedition;
(i) A person engaged in the business of manufacturing, repairing, or dealing in firearms, or the agent or representative of any such person while engaged in the lawful course of such business;
(j) A person firing weapons for testing or target practice under safe conditions and in a safe place not prohibited by law or going to or from such place;
(k) A person firing weapons in a safe and secure indoor range for testing and target practice;
(l) A person traveling by private conveyance when the weapon is securely encased or in a public conveyance when the weapon is securely encased and not in the person's manual possession;
(790.001 Definitions.--As used in this chapter, except where the context otherwise requires:
(17) "Securely encased" means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked; snapped in a holster; in a gun case, whether or not locked; in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access. )
(m) A person while carrying a pistol unloaded and in a secure wrapper, concealed or otherwise, from the place of purchase to his or her home or place of business or to a place of repair or back to his or her home or place of business;
(n) A person possessing arms at his or her home or place of business;
(o) Investigators employed by the several public defenders of the state, while actually carrying out official duties, provided such investigators:
1. Are employed full time;
2. Meet the official training standards for firearms established by the Criminal Justice Standards and Training Commission as provided in s. 943.12(5) and the requirements of ss. 493.6108(1)(a) and 943.13(1)-(4); and
3. Are individually designated by an affidavit of consent signed by the employing public defender and filed with the clerk of the circuit court in the county in which the employing public defender resides.
(p) Investigators employed by the capital collateral regional counsel, while actually carrying out official duties, provided such investigators:
1. Are employed full time;
2. Meet the official training standards for firearms as established by the Criminal Justice Standards and Training Commission as provided in s. 943.12(1) and the requirements of ss. 493.6108(1)(a) and 943.13(1)-(4); and
3. Are individually designated by an affidavit of consent signed by the capital collateral regional counsel and filed with the clerk of the circuit court in the county in which the investigator is headquartered.
Last edited on Fri Sep 7th, 2007 09:31 pm by Reverend73
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captainamerica
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Posted: Fri Sep 7th, 2007 10:22 pm |
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As mentioned, if you were on your own property then they are likely out of line.
Next time (if there is a next time) consider unloading the weapon, place the shells/magazine in a container, place the unloaded weapon in a container, seal, lock (optional?), and take discretely to your vehicle.
Simply put, firearms have to be handled to and from vehicles, so there's got to be a right way if CCW and OC is not an option.
This is the way I do it when I bring in a handgun to my hotel room at night and return it to my car the next day if I'm in a state where CCW and/or OC is not an option.
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yankees98a
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Posted: Sat Sep 8th, 2007 02:06 am |
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Most likely op post property was a condo type property where others saw him and called it in...
Where didhe go?
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HankT
State Researcher
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Posted: Sat Sep 8th, 2007 04:35 am |
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yankees98a wrote: Most likely op post property was a condo type property where others saw him and called it in...
You may very well be right. Common areas are not considered private residence nor are they curtilage. If one walks armed through a common area, one is either CCing or OCing.
tony wrote: I am a Florida resident that has punchiest a gun for my protection. I have been charged with open carry of a firearm 790.053. The situation is I had guest visiting with children and did not fell comfortable leaving my gun at home. Did not have my license yet so could not conceal my firearm, so I unload my gun place it in a holster and carry it to my car, place it in the glove box and drive away. Ten minutes later a police officer pulls me over with four other cars to assist in a takedown. Now I have been charged with open carry of a firearm. So how can I do this, if I conceal the gun I will be committing a felony and if I don’t it is a misdemeanor? How do I get my gun from my house to my car without becoming a criminal? The important part the kids are safe at my house! There is a level of responsibility in being a gun owner, and I thought that was me.
Was there any ammunition on your person or in the car or in the gun when the police stopped you? I'm hoping there wasn't but I suspect there was.
In answer to your question: How do I get my gun from my house to my car without becoming a criminal?
I think that an unloaded gun in almost any kind of container/bag/box taken from your home to your car and transported not on your person would be OK.
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Reverend73
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Sat Sep 8th, 2007 03:45 pm |
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HankT wrote: Was there any ammunition on your person or in the car or in the gun when the police stopped you? I'm hoping there wasn't but I suspect there was.
In answer to your question: How do I get my gun from my house to my car without becoming a criminal?
I think that an unloaded gun in almost any kind of container/bag/box taken from your home to your car and transported not on your person would be OK.
did you happen to read the florida statutes I posted. Loaded car carry is fine as long as it is securely encased, per the statutes. He had it in the glove box, he was within the law once he got it to his car.
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HankT
State Researcher
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Posted: Sat Sep 8th, 2007 04:33 pm |
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Reverend73 wrote: HankT wrote: Was there any ammunition on your person or in the car or in the gun when the police stopped you? I'm hoping there wasn't but I suspect there was.
In answer to your question: How do I get my gun from my house to my car without becoming a criminal?
I think that an unloaded gun in almost any kind of container/bag/box taken from your home to your car and transported not on your person would be OK.
did you happen to read the florida statutes I posted. Loaded car carry is fine as long as it is securely encased, per the statutes. He had it in the glove box, he was within the law once he got it to his car.
Try to keep up, Reverend.
I'm not questioning the time during which the gun was in the glove box. That's a trivial question. Everybody knows the answer.
If the OP got arrested for open carrying it, assuming the LEO wasn't an idiot, had to be when he was walking with a gun on his hip or if it was displayed openly in his car. I suspect the former but it could be the latter. We need to know exactly for what the OP was charged as open carrying.
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mvpel
Regular Member
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Posted: Sun Sep 9th, 2007 04:39 am |
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Kind of pitiful that you have to wiggle through all these BS legal technicalities to exercise a fundamental human right.
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Tomahawk
Regular Member
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Posted: Sun Sep 9th, 2007 05:34 am |
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mvpel wrote: Kind of pitiful that you have to wiggle through all these BS legal technicalities to exercise a fundamental human right.
Yup. That's why some people just shove it down their pants and ignore the law. Shouldn't feel any need to do that in this (or any) country.
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captainamerica
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Posted: Mon Sep 10th, 2007 03:48 pm |
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When I got into my teens it amazed me to find out that our government was more afraid of us than most of us were of our government. As you know (and so do our public servants), the Second Amendment is the only one that guarantees all the rest.
And the sad thing is, our government takes our freedom largely one regulation at a time, slowly, methodically, inch by inch, piece by piece. Like a glacier that moves 1 to 3 inches per year but 500 feet over the long haul. Course there are now 1000's of firearm regulations. Note as an example not long ago I was a law abiding Missourian until we went right instead of left after a gas stop and a couple of miles later we ended up crossing the bridge into Quincy, IL. At that very moment we became felons (not unlike a communist country) deserving of jail time and further loss of our rights.
Government by the people, for the people, and of the people works best when term limits and accountability for their service is not only expected, but required. Our forefathers knew how to hold the government accountable but all we care about is our golf tee time, our kids soccor practice, getting to Starbucks for some mocha-latte before they close, and picking up which take-out for dinner tonight.
Wake up America!
Tomahawk wrote:
mvpel wrote: Kind of pitiful that you have to wiggle through all these BS legal technicalities to exercise a fundamental human right.
Yup. That's why some people just shove it down their pants and ignore the law. Shouldn't feel any need to do that in this (or any) country.
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junglebob
Regular Member
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Posted: Mon Sep 10th, 2007 07:38 pm |
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| CaptainAmerica, Some of us Illinoisans are trying to change things at Illinoiscarry.com. Some of us already have non-resident licenses from Florida, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire and Utah and we excercise our rights when outside of the Peoples Republic of Illinois. A tip to travelers through "right denied Illinois" if stopped at a sobriety checkpoint or for other reason excercise your 4th amendment right to say no to a request to search your vehicle. I'd also avoid the Chicago area like the plague.
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tony
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Posted: Tue Sep 11th, 2007 02:40 pm |
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My ? is can I open carry on my property? this is what I was arrested for. it was not for open carry in the car. It was open carry on my property, when I walked a unloaded gun from my home to my car the officer observed the gun in a hulster hanging from my hand. the officer did not stop me on my property becuase he needed back up and that took ten minutes, so he followed me for ten minutes.
I am a Florida resident that has punchiest a gun for my protection. I have been charged with open carry of a firearm 790.053. The situation is I had guest visiting with children and did not fell comfortable leaving my gun at home. Did not have my license yet so could not conceal my firearm, so I unload my gun place it in a holster and carry it to my car, place it in the glove box and drive away. Ten minutes later a police officer pulls me over with four other cars to assist in a takedown. Now I have been charged with open carry of a firearm. So how can I do this, if I conceal the gun I will be committing a felony and if I don’t it is a misdemeanor? How do I get my gun from my house to my car without becoming a criminal? The important part the kids are safe at my house! There is a level of responsibility in being a gun owner, and I thought that was me.
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HankT
State Researcher
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Posted: Tue Sep 11th, 2007 02:51 pm |
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tony wrote: My ? is can I open carry on my property? this is what I was arrested for. it was not for open carry in the car. It was open carry on my property, when I walked a unloaded gun from my home to my car the officer observed the gun in a hulster hanging from my hand. the officer did not stop me on my property becuase he needed back up and that took ten minutes, so he followed me for ten minutes.
Did you have any ammo on you?
Do you have a separate home or do you have a condo?
Did the arresting officer say that he was charging you for carry on your property? What did he say exactly?
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tony
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Posted: Tue Sep 11th, 2007 03:03 pm |
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| Here’s the run down. I took the charge, he got me on a tech. My car was parked on the sidewalk and that is not my property. So I open carried on public property when I put my foot on the sidewalk. Guilty, I have to pay court cost, with hold and return of my gun. This is not his original story he told me, he side I can not open carry any where. What is it can I open carry on my property?
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HankT
State Researcher
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Posted: Tue Sep 11th, 2007 03:07 pm |
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tony wrote: Here’s the run down. I took the charge, he got me on a tech. My car was parked on the sidewalk and that is not my property. So I open carried on public property when I put my foot on the sidewalk. Guilty, I have to pay court cost, with hold and return of my gun.
Curtilage is an important word and concept for you.
Did you have any ammo on you?
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ralphb72
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Posted: Tue Sep 11th, 2007 04:27 pm |
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| Tony, GET A LAWYER, don't agree to anything or admit anything until you talk with your laywer, stop talking about this on here until after everytyhing is settled (anyone can read this here), then come back and update us. Last edited on Tue Sep 11th, 2007 04:29 pm by ralphb72
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bayboy42
Regular Member
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Posted: Tue Sep 11th, 2007 04:42 pm |
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Hey Ralph....read Tony's last post a little closer....looks to me like things are already settled...
I took the charge, he got me on a tech. My car was parked on the sidewalk and that is not my property. So I open carried on public property when I put my foot on the sidewalk. Guilty, I have to pay court cost, with hold and return of my gun.
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