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Jerry McBride
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 04:42 pm |
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nolacopusmc wrote: derf wrote:
2. And, BTW, about 99% of posters seem to use aliases. It could be because they are not interested in self promotion.
2. Bingo
Or, it could be they aren't interested in self promotion. Or, it could be...Last edited on Fri Jun 26th, 2009 09:45 pm by Jerry McBride
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mark edward marchiafava
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 04:52 pm |
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What a shame. Most of you "supporters of OC" refuse to learn.
Not just every person employed anywhere can make such a statement ( you can't be here/ you need to leave).
You must satisfy certain requirements of LAW ( not your opinion) to be considered an "authorized agent."
Example: Walking across the parking lot of Dollar General in Central, some 16 year old sweeping the parking lot looks at me, "sir, you can't go in there."
Without confirming for a fact, I doubt seriously he's an "authorized agent of the corporation." Furthermore, I doubt he personally owns that particular location.
I went in after demonstrating to him the signage on the door he THOUGHT was there, wasn't.
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rmansu2
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 07:25 pm |
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| Just left from a lunch meeting with a friend at Canes on Siegen no problems.
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Anty506
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 09:21 pm |
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rmansu2 wrote: Anthony, were you actually asked to leave by the manager, or did he make the statement "You can't have that here"?
The reason I ask is are these statements the same. An uninformed decleration of your rights(or privleges) is not the same as a request for you not to do something.
I am not a confrontational person. But, if I were in a retail location and asked to leave by an uninformed uneducated(on that businesses policies) associate asked me to leave I would undoubtably leave without question. The only way I would not leave is if by chance I had been asked to leave on a previous ocassion and had contacted management for clarification and had his name and number readily available.
If this same person made the off-handed comment "You cannot have that here", I would have to ask some questions as to why. Hopefully, and in many cases it has, it would lead to a civilized discussion of our 2A and (Mark's favorite) Article 1 Section 11.
My question to everyone is, does the statement "You can't have that here" amount to the same as "You must leave the premises".
I was asked to leave by the manger after the Hammond PD officer got pissed off. Hammond's finest went and had him ask me to leave and he stated that their policy is no guns.
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derf
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 09:24 pm |
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mark edward marchiafava wrote: What a shame. Most of you "supporters of OC" refuse to learn.
Not just every person employed anywhere can make such a statement ( you can't be here/ you need to leave).
You must satisfy certain requirements of LAW ( not your opinion) to be considered an "authorized agent."
Example: Walking across the parking lot of Dollar General in Central, some 16 year old sweeping the parking lot looks at me, "sir, you can't go in there."
Without confirming for a fact, I doubt seriously he's an "authorized agent of the corporation." Furthermore, I doubt he personally owns that particular location.
I went in after demonstrating to him the signage on the door he THOUGHT was there, wasn't.
I agree there are people who do not know and/or follow the policies of their employers. I say correct them if they are wrong. A polite, tactful correction is always preferred.
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XD-GEM
Activist Member
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 02:53 am |
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derf wrote: mark edward marchiafava wrote: What a shame. Most of you "supporters of OC" refuse to learn.
Not just every person employed anywhere can make such a statement ( you can't be here/ you need to leave).
You must satisfy certain requirements of LAW ( not your opinion) to be considered an "authorized agent."
Example: Walking across the parking lot of Dollar General in Central, some 16 year old sweeping the parking lot looks at me, "sir, you can't go in there."
Without confirming for a fact, I doubt seriously he's an "authorized agent of the corporation." Furthermore, I doubt he personally owns that particular location.
I went in after demonstrating to him the signage on the door he THOUGHT was there, wasn't.
I agree there are people who do not know and/or follow the policies of their employers. I say correct them if they are wrong. A polite, tactful correction is always preferred.
And that is why "You can't have that here" does not equal "You must leave."
"You can't have that here" is too nebulous and requires clarification; that means you have to ask them what they mean by that statement. One is not required to leave unless and until they are specifically told to do so.
After all, if I go into Canes and ask for a Whopper, they are likely to tell me, "You can't have that here." 
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nolacopusmc
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 08:20 am |
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rmansu2 wrote: Just left from a lunch meeting with a friend at Canes on Siegen no problems.
Because you are not a self-promoting attention whore looking for a paycheck while riding a motorcycle paid by people who work for a living while you r wife is home unable to get an MRi because you are so poor.
Good job on not being a dip@#$%. 
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wrightme
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 06:33 pm |
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lsushawn wrote: charlie12 wrote: Mike wrote:And why did you ask them? why not just carry there and go about your business?
Mike meet Anty506.
and yet he remained and asked to see a policy, should have been arrested for remaining after being asked to leave. the manager of a buisiness does not have to show you a written policy or even have one in place at all, if he/she wants you to leave, you must leave gun or no gun. will you ever learn? Being asked to leave is a request. Being told to leave or be "trespassed" is a different thing.
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wrightme
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 06:36 pm |
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nolacopusmc wrote: rmansu2 wrote: Just left from a lunch meeting with a friend at Canes on Siegen no problems.
Because you are not a self-promoting attention whore looking for a paycheck while riding a motorcycle paid by people who work for a living while you r wife is home unable to get an MRi because you are so poor.
Good job on not being a dip@#$%.
Pardon, your single-minded hatred for one person is showing......again.......
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nolacopusmc
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 12:50 am |
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wrightme wrote: lsushawn wrote: charlie12 wrote: Mike wrote:And why did you ask them? why not just carry there and go about your business?
Mike meet Anty506.
and yet he remained and asked to see a policy, should have been arrested for remaining after being asked to leave. the manager of a buisiness does not have to show you a written policy or even have one in place at all, if he/she wants you to leave, you must leave gun or no gun. will you ever learn? Being asked to leave is a request. Being told to leave or be "trespassed" is a different thing.
Wrong answer kid. Try again.
Doesn't matter how it is phrased. Asked, told, sign language, smoke signals. Once it is clear, to normal people, not the overly critical people here, you are trespassing.
COuld you please leave? makes it clear you are not wanted. Come to Louisiana, and you will find yourself sharing a cell with JimmyDean.
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nolacopusmc
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 12:51 am |
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wrightme wrote: nolacopusmc wrote: rmansu2 wrote: Just left from a lunch meeting with a friend at Canes on Siegen no problems.
Because you are not a self-promoting attention whore looking for a paycheck while riding a motorcycle paid by people who work for a living while you r wife is home unable to get an MRi because you are so poor.
Good job on not being a dip@#$%.
Pardon, your single-minded hatred for one person is showing......again.......
TRUDTH., but it is not single minded, and it is definitely for more than one person.
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dirty_sanchez
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 03:34 pm |
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I've open carried at RC's on Coursey and in the location on Range in Denham this past week without an issue.
A few looks, yes, but no one was alarmed, anyone I made eye contact with, I just smiled and noded my head.
Dirty
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yale
Regular Member
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 04:34 pm |
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I don't go out for chicken often but last week I carried into the KFC at Bluebonnett and Perkins and picked up an order to go. Had my Bersa. 380 on my belt at the 4o'clock position. Sorry, no crossdraw for me. My belly is too big for that.  No problems or weird looks from staff or other customers.
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kimber10mm
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 02:47 am |
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and yet he remained and asked to see a policy, should have been arrested for remaining after being asked to leave. the manager of a buisiness does not have to show you a written policy or even have one in place at all, if he/she wants you to leave, you must leave gun or no gun. will you ever learn?
does it look like it?
all he wants to do it start trouble what he doesnt understand is that if a property owner says "NO", it means NO!
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mark edward marchiafava
Regular Member
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:07 am |
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and will YOU ever learn a manager is NOT a property owner?
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nolacopusmc
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:21 am |
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mark edward marchiafava wrote: and will YOU ever learn a manager is NOT a property owner?
maybe not, but he is an agent. I ran a large retail store for a year, and all my mangers, asst managers, and team leaders had authority to request someone leave.
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JeepSeller
Regular Member
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:58 am |
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mark edward marchiafava wrote: and will YOU ever learn a manager is NOT a property owner?
Your statement is true but flawed. While, yes, in most cases, a manager is NOT the owner, it is possible for the business and property owner to also act as the business manager. Also, where your statement ends so does your logic regarding this issue.
The concept needs to be thought out just a little bit further.
While the manager may not be the owner, the manager can act as a representative or agent of the owner in the eyes of the law.
While you may not like those facts....disliking them fails to change those facts.
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smoking357
Banned
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 04:26 am |
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mark edward marchiafava wrote: and will YOU ever learn a manager is NOT a property owner?
They don't want to learn. They want to justify lots of police action.
I wonder what they'd do if the manager tried to eject the property owner or the owner's agent. I mean, it's not like cops know how to sort through title law, covenants, leases, rights of entry and interests, certainly not on the fly.
It would be funny if the cops took the manager's word and arrested the property owner or the owner's agent. What a lawsuit that would be, and the cops would also be looking at a suit against them for trespass, since the property owner would have told them to take it down the road.
This is stuff the cops should stay out of. Cops are not the security force for private business, and company policy is not part of the Criminal Code, as such is the living definition of fascism.
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charlie12
Regular Member
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 04:39 am |
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smoking357 wrote: mark edward marchiafava wrote: and will YOU ever learn a manager is NOT a property owner?
They don't want to learn. They want to justify lots of police action.
I wonder what they'd do if the manager tried to eject the property owner or the owner's agent. I mean, it's not like cops know how to sort through title law, covenants, leases, rights of entry and interests, certainly not on the fly.
It would be funny if the cops took the manager's word and arrested the property owner or the owner's agent. What a lawsuit that would be, and the cops would also be looking at a suit against them for trespass, since the property owner would have told them to take it down the road.
This is stuff the cops should stay out of. Cops are not the security force for private business, and company policy is not part of the Criminal Code, as such is the living definition of fascism.
Cracksmoker, Trespassing is and RS 14:63.3 and others.
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bsmit24
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:21 am |
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nolacopusmc wrote: mark edward marchiafava wrote: and will YOU ever learn a manager is NOT a property owner?
maybe not, but he is an agent. I ran a large retail store for a year, and all my mangers, asst managers, and team leaders had authority to request someone leave.
You may not know this as a manager of a retail store but as a small business owner who just amended my filings, an agent is listed on your filings with the sec of state. this can be changed or amended at anytime but typically managers, asst managers, team leaders, etc are not listed as agents but owners, office olders and attorneys are. That is not to say they can not be but it is not the norm.
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