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KalelIsbell
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Jul 2nd, 2009 |
| Location: | Riverton, Utah USA |
| Posts: | 5 |
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 11:22 pm |
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An officer for West Jordan City just informed us that if you are seen carring a gun in West Jordan and someone calls and complains, they will and i quote" have 10 officers surround, you throw you to the ground, point guns at your head, arrest you,
confiscate your gun, and site you for being a public nuisance" end quote, they are not going to talk to you, in fact the office was very angry about the whole idea of open carry ...He then said you may get your gun back, but you will not get out of the citation...
Last edited on Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:56 pm by KalelIsbell
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GeneticsDave
Regular Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 11:28 pm |
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| If you don't have names or recordings, it never happened. Please let us know who you talked to. We will get this resolved.
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SecondAmendmentStudents
Regular Member
| Joined: | Mon May 7th, 2007 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 50 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 12:30 am |
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| I just sent an email to the West Jordan mayor and city council about 6-1B-2 (12) and how it relates to 63K-4-405. As one of West Jordan's newest residents, I'd be fascinated if they mistakenly believed they had some authority to prohibit OCing.
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ScottyT
Regular Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 12:50 am |
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Is there a restaurant in West Jordan for our next dinner? I know we had talked Layton Red Robin, but seems like WJC would be more appropriate?
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GeneticsDave
Regular Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 01:05 am |
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ScottyT wrote:
Is there a restaurant in West Jordan for our next dinner? I know we had talked Layton Red Robin, but seems like WJC would be more appropriate?
Linky
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UtahJarhead
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Sep 24th, 2009 |
| Location: | Ogden, UT |
| Posts: | 109 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 01:57 am |
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HA! It almost sounds like they're TAUNTING the OC community.  Yes, the Layton Red Robin is on the books probably for Jan (they already OK'd it) but we can certainly do one in the interim between Nov 5 and whenever we that for Jan in Layton.
(Off Topic, but the regional manager for RR is very Pro-2A and carries a CFP!)
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carlj
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| Joined: | Wed Nov 4th, 2009 |
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| Posts: | 2 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 02:29 am |
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I can attest to this incident. I was the person questioning the officer and what kalelisbell said is exactly correct. i informed him that my constitutional rights would be severely violated if i were to be detained due to open carry. in response to this he said just because i have a right doesn't mean i should use it. I was amazed at his arrogance and disdain for the idea of me carrying a gun openly. I informed him that the city could face a lawsuit if the police responded in the manner that he spoke of. he balked at this comment and said "well you can try but you will lose everytime, this is our department policy".
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UtahJarhead
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Sep 24th, 2009 |
| Location: | Ogden, UT |
| Posts: | 109 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 02:38 am |
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carlj, he can quote his department policy all he wants... here's what any OC'er in WJ needs to quote (relevant parts in bold):
76-10-500. Uniform law.
(1) The individual right to keep and bear arms being a constitutionally protected right, the Legislature finds the need to provide uniform laws throughout the state. Except as specifically provided by state law, a citizen of the United States or a lawfully admitted alien shall not be:
(a) prohibited from owning, possessing, purchasing, selling, transferring, transporting, or keeping any firearm at his place of residence, property, business, or in any vehicle lawfully in his possession or lawfully under his control; or
(b) required to have a permit or license to purchase, own, possess, transport, or keep a firearm.
(2) This part is uniformly applicable throughout this state and in all its political subdivisions and municipalities. All authority to regulate firearms shall be reserved to the state except where the Legislature specifically delegates responsibility to local authorities or state entities. Unless specifically authorized by the Legislature by statute, a local authority or state entity may not enact or enforce any ordinance, regulation, or rule pertaining to firearms.
What I would WANT to do, but would not because it would be pretty dumb, would be to tell him to go pound sand.
Edit: didn't hilight all of the applicable subsections
Last edited on Thu Nov 5th, 2009 02:55 am by UtahJarhead
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UtahJarhead
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Sep 24th, 2009 |
| Location: | Ogden, UT |
| Posts: | 109 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 02:40 am |
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KalelIsbell and carlj, do you have the officer's name and/or badge number? It will give us a little bit of ammo when we confront the department about this. Even if it's vocal, it's still a threat in my eyes, one that is intended to intimidate citizens into an action the officer wants, even if it's not within his authority.
Last edited on Thu Nov 5th, 2009 02:41 am by UtahJarhead
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GeneticsDave
Regular Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 02:49 am |
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I agree with the Marine, we need to know who you were speaking with. Then we can contact his department chief and find out "official" department policy. If that policy goes against what the officer said, we need to be able to provide the name/badge of the office so he can be enlightened. If departmental policy IS as the officer stated, we need to have the AGs office and Clark Aposhian have a little talk with the chief.
Either way, we can't do much until we know WHO you talked to.
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ScottyT
Regular Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 03:20 am |
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I would have told him to pound sand. His job is to enforce the law as it stands, not to satisfy his ego by enforcing opinion.
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gunsfreak4791
Regular Member
| Joined: | Fri Jun 13th, 2008 |
| Location: | Kearns, Utah USA |
| Posts: | 509 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:35 am |
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So what is the officer's name
I am calling this B.S until I have more Info and a legitimate source. both posters have less then 5 posts
I need more info so I can validate this claim.
Last edited on Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:41 am by gunsfreak4791
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jaredbelch
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 05:05 am |
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gunsfreak4791 wrote: So what is the officer's name
I am calling this B.S until I have more Info and a legitimate source. both posters have less then 5 posts
I need more info so I can validate this claim.
I'm leaning toward this attitude as well.
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carlj
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| Joined: | Wed Nov 4th, 2009 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 05:05 am |
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we are still making sure we have the right name for this officer. i wouldn't want to be wrongly accused of this sort of thing. tomorrow i will post the name.
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gunsfreak4791
Regular Member
| Joined: | Fri Jun 13th, 2008 |
| Location: | Kearns, Utah USA |
| Posts: | 509 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 03:59 pm |
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Thank you sorry to be so harsh but with the low posts and all of our troll friends sometimes it is a bit difficult to believe everything I hear.
I would like to extend a greeting and a welcome to OCDO
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KalelIsbell
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Jul 2nd, 2009 |
| Location: | Riverton, Utah USA |
| Posts: | 5 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:14 pm |
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So let me get this straight, because I’m new to this posting thing and only have a few post, you say BS, well I think your comment is BS, if you’re going to call BS at my post because I’m new then maybe I should join another fourm, because I was under the opinion that this was a place to post OC ideas, and experiences.. I guess I was wrong,,,,, my bad………………………………………
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UtahJarhead
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Sep 24th, 2009 |
| Location: | Ogden, UT |
| Posts: | 109 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:17 pm |
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Look at it from our perspective, KaleIsbell... we get people all the time that come here, stir up the muck from the bottom of the pond, then sit back and laugh. By definition, that's a Troll.
You and your corroborating poster have an EXTREMELY low post count and are bringing us a VERY controversial story. We *ARE* on your side, but from our point of view, so far until you can prove that it's not (by giving us the name of the officer(s), then you do fit the profile of a troll.
We're not trying to offend you, but you also have to view things from our perspective.
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jaredbelch
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:26 pm |
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KalelIsbell wrote: So let me get this straight, because I’m new to this posting thing and only have a few post, you say BS, well I think your comment is BS, if you’re going to call BS at my post because I’m new then maybe I should join another fourm, because I was under the opinion that this was a place to post OC ideas, and experiences.. I guess I was wrong,,,,, my bad………………………………………
Post away, this is the right place. Just don't tell a slightly unbelievable story and not expect to get requests for more info. Most of us here OC quite often and have never had a serious issue with the police. So when someone we don't know has issues, it's harder to believe. And since most of us know each other from meetups, we are more willing to trust someone we know.
Just because some (2 or 3) are hesitant to roll the calvary on your words alone doesn't mean it didn't happen or that you picked the wrong place to post. Quite the opposite really, once you've gained the trust of this group, I don't think you could have better allies. Trust is earned not automatic, don't despair, but don't expect the internet to treat you the same way your best friend does.
(And it doesn't help to go all ballistic when challenged either)
Last edited on Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:27 pm by jaredbelch
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KalelIsbell
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Jul 2nd, 2009 |
| Location: | Riverton, Utah USA |
| Posts: | 5 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 04:56 pm |
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Sorry
We will find out the officers name post ASAP
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LovesHisXD45
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Jul 3rd, 2008 |
| Location: | Utah USA |
| Posts: | 424 |
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 09:40 pm |
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Let's go OC in West Jordan soon, oh please. I could use an extra nest egg for my retirement compliments of the great city of West Jordan and their legal defense fund padded by the tax-payers.
It's plain and simple. OC is legal in utah. Therefore, the mere presence of an openly-carried sidearm does not constitute articulable reasonable suspicion or probable cause that I have and/or an in the commission of a crime. The report of MWAG does not constitute such a response as stated by the rogue opinion enforcement officer of his cohorts. 76-10-500 preemption nullifies all ordinances. Ignorance of the law is not a defense to prosecution. So, if they wanna go that route and try to be big scary opinion enforcement entities, that's ok with me. I will enjoy watching them squirm in court, and there will be successive case law to help others as a result.
There is no greater satisfaction than taking a person in a position of power and crushing his/her ego into dust and destroying their ability to bully people with their self-righteous agendas under the guise of public safety.
Kevin
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