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Grapeshot
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Thu Feb 26th, 2009 04:15 pm |
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NavyLT wrote: NYShooter wrote: I agree , you go by the state you are visiting. But the adjoining states I am applying to have different restrictions. If your home state does not allow you full carry then you can't do it in the state you visit either unless it is under certain conditions. My example is a friend of mine from NJ. He only has a residence permit for that state, but he can use his handgun to hunt in PA, no other purpose allowed. Like I said , I don't know if VT is the same.
Your CCW is just like your driver's license. You abide by the laws of the road you are driving on, not by the laws of where your license is from.
Not always exactly the case. If one possessed a restricted DL from Va. permitting them to only drive during the day light or to and from work, they are not legal to drive in PA. after dark while on vacation.
It would seem to me that restrictions on gun/carry permits from your home state might well present a problem elsewhere.
Yata hey
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JoeSparky
Centurion Member
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Posted: Sat Feb 28th, 2009 03:17 am |
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Grapeshot wrote: NavyLT wrote: NYShooter wrote:
Your CCW is just like your driver's license. You abide by the laws of the road you are driving on, not by the laws of where your license is from.
Not always exactly the case. If one possessed a restricted DL from Va. permitting them to only drive during the day light or to and from work, they are not legal to drive in PA. after dark while on vacation.
It would seem to me that restrictions on gun/carry permits from your home state might well present a problem elsewhere.
Yata hey
If they EVER institute a Firearms permit recognition system like the DL compact agreement between states that requires/allows any state to enforce the restrictions of another state with regard to DL's then one might have to abide by the home state restrictions.
Here's hoping that a National Recognition is approved that does not require ANY licence to carry concealed or otherwise....
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Grapeshot
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Sat Feb 28th, 2009 02:45 pm |
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JoeSparky wrote: snip..........
Here's hoping that a National Recognition is approved that does not require ANY licence to carry concealed or otherwise....
Gasp ! You do realize you are advocating full acceptance and agreement with the Second Amendment? Perhaps you even intend for complete preemption at the national level of our RTKBA ! Would that it could be so in my lifetime.
Yata hey
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JoeSparky
Centurion Member
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Posted: Sun Mar 1st, 2009 02:13 am |
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Grapeshot wrote: JoeSparky wrote: snip..........
Here's hoping that a National Recognition is approved that does not require ANY licence to carry concealed or otherwise....
Gasp ! You do realize you are advocating full acceptance and agreement with the Second Amendment? Perhaps you even intend for complete preemption at the national level of our RTKBA ! Would that it could be so in my lifetime.
Yata hey
I am appaulled that we find ourselves in a situation where the government at any level has the ability to PRE-EMPTIVELY intervene in our lives, liberty, and pursuit of happiness by regulation, legeslation, and breauracracy!
ELIMINATE ALL LAWS THAT DO SUCH. By the same token... If I drive in such a manner that I cause injury to another... make me pay the bill!
I should not have to pay an artificially raised cost because someone decided that May 1986 was a good month and year to dis-allow otherwise law abiding citizens from possessing, owning, making a class 3 weapon, silencer, etc.
off soapbox!
edited for spelling... more spelling errors may remain!
Last edited on Sun Mar 1st, 2009 02:15 am by JoeSparky
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sheepdog
Regular Member
| Joined: | Wed Mar 12th, 2008 |
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| Posts: | 195 |
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Posted: Sun Mar 1st, 2009 08:43 pm |
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| ...actually, an important part of 18USC922 is (D).... D) the possession of a handgun or ammunition by a juvenile taken in defense of the juvenile or other persons against an intruder into the residence of the juvenile or a residence in which the juvenile is an invited guest. ......and a juvenile may have a handgun and ammunition within the Fed. laws with a note from parents...on the way to and from a listed activity allowed by state law....it's not really too restrictive....
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carryall
Regular Member
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Posted: Mon Mar 2nd, 2009 12:03 am |
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Hello,
As a matter of course, nj does not extend the right of CWP to anyone other than lawyers, judges and politicians. Go figure. nj may issue a subject an FID card, which is needed to then apply to your local police chief to beg a permit to purchase a pistol, if the chief so desires you as a subject, to be granted one.
Unless you are the lucky few, and I mean few, who have a permit to carry concealed in nj, the only thing you will have if granted to you is your nj firearms identification card, and individually granted or denied permits to purchase a pistol(s), each individually approved or denied by your local police chief. If you at any given time are denied by your local police chief the right to purchase a pistol, your only recourse is to file a claim with your local nj superior court. Most often that court will rule with the local police chief and uphold your denied request to purchase. The strange thing is a matter of nj law, the judge basically has to declare you to be a known danger to the overall health and welfare to society. I have seen this done
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NavyLT
Regular Member
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Posted: Mon Mar 2nd, 2009 01:30 am |
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CHEYENNE wrote: IMHO, VT is the only state that truelly supports 2A, no infringment their!!
Bummer I moved to AZ, now I gotta spend $150-$200 Someday I'll go back, someday soon
and Alaska. It is a state now, you know :-)
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hudson valley
Regular Member
| Joined: | Fri Jun 5th, 2009 |
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Posted: Sun Jun 7th, 2009 12:39 am |
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modificationvt wrote: If I remember correctly any citizen of the US can CC or OC in Vermont. I believe that anyone can carry as long as they are not doing so for an illegal purpose....
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Thundar
Regular Member
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Posted: Thu Jun 11th, 2009 05:29 pm |
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CHEYENNE wrote: IMHO, VT is the only state that truelly supports 2A, no infringment their!!
Bummer I moved to AZ, now I gotta spend $150-$200 Someday I'll go back, someday soon
Alaska is pretty good too.
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Smurfologist
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Jun 13th, 2009 01:44 am |
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SIGguy229 wrote: NYShooter wrote: I'm not 100% sure about VT, but I have a non-resident permit for PA and their rules are that you are limited to your home states permit conditions. Which means, if you have a permit that is restricted to your home and not full carry you can not carry in public. Or if you have just for hunting then you can only carry while hunting etc. Since you are from Westchester I'm sure you don't have full carry. I would check with the states laws first even though residents don't need a permit.
How sure of this are you? Citation please.
When carrying in another state, you go by the laws of the state you are visiting--not your home state.
Afterall, how could one state enforce another state's laws?
For example, in certain states, you cannot carry a firearm in a restaurant that serves alcohol. In VA--you MUST open carry in restaurants that serve alcohol. If I visit another state--I don't OC--I adhere to the laws of the state I'm visiting.
I believe the state of Indiana may be an exception as far as recognizing all state's handgun license. For example, VA's handgun license specifies "concealed" handgun license, so, one must conceal carry in Indiana (if there are off limit areas that Indiana has, they must be recognized and respected). If one have a license that does not specify "concealed" handgun license such as PA's handgun license, one can OC or CC (if I need to be corrected about any of this, please do so).
This brings me to an interesting question: "Since Indiana recognizes other states handgun licenses, would Indiana recognize a VT citizen's right to OC or CC without a license (since they don't need a license to OC or CC)?"
The 2nd Amendment... brought to you by Beretta and the number 1787!!
Last edited on Sat Jun 13th, 2009 01:46 am by Smurfologist
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Leverdude
Regular Member
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Posted: Sun Jun 14th, 2009 05:07 am |
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: "Since Indiana recognizes other states handgun licenses, would Indiana recognize a VT citizen's right to OC or CC without a license (since they don't need a license to OC or CC)?"
Nope, thats why AK has a pistol permit if you want it even though you dont need it.
But as far as I know if another state recognizes your permit you go by that states laws.
In VT its a moot point because there are no laws to break & nothing to charge you with unless you actually commit a crime.
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Smurfologist
Regular Member
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Posted: Mon Jun 15th, 2009 06:31 am |
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Leverdude wrote: : "Since Indiana recognizes other states handgun licenses, would Indiana recognize a VT citizen's right to OC or CC without a license (since they don't need a license to OC or CC)?"
Nope, thats why AK has a pistol permit if you want it even though you dont need it.
But as far as I know if another state recognizes your permit you go by that states laws.
In VT its a moot point because there are no laws to break & nothing to charge you with unless you actually commit a crime.
Here is a link that explains what I was trying to say in my post:
I love VT's CC/OC rules. It makes me want to retire there (smile). However, VT may want to go the route of AK so that they won't have any issues in other states (like Indiana). Of course, a VT resident could just get a non-resident license from another state (like UT, NH, or PA).
The 2nd Amendment... brought to you by Beretta and the number 1787!!
Last edited on Mon Jun 15th, 2009 06:32 am by Smurfologist
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Yooper
Regular Member
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Posted: Tue Jun 16th, 2009 10:50 am |
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This is how this works.......
If you have a permit, say a Concealed WEAPONS permit from Florida, you can carry in any state that honors that florida permit. BUT you have to follow the laws of the state you are in.
Example, Michigan has a Concealed PISTOL license, and also recognizes permits from all other states. But Michigan law only allows for the carrying of concealed PISTOLS and not WEAPONS in general. Therefore, a Florida resident carrying a handgun in Michigan is ok, but a Florida resident carrying brass knuckles is a no-no in Michigan.
Unlike NY/NJ and a few other states, most allow citizens and non citizens to openly carry a handgun without any permit. The state of Colorado doesn't give a rats butt if you need a permit to posses/carry/transport a handgun in NY or NJ, all they care about is that you follow Colorado's laws.
VT works the same way, they don't care if I have 20 permits, or none, as long as I follow the laws of VT. Since VT doesn't prohibit persons from carrying a handgun, anybody (law abiding of course) can.
The only ones I wouldn't be sure on are those jurisdictions that place restrictions on concealed licenses. Usually they are seen in "may issue" states. Would Utah recognize a permit from Iowa that's restricted to hunting and target shooting only as a fully authorized permit in their state? I don't know.
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Yooper
Regular Member
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Posted: Tue Jun 16th, 2009 10:53 am |
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This is how this works.......
If you have a permit, say a Concealed WEAPONS permit from Florida, you can carry in any state that honors that florida permit. BUT you have to follow the laws of the state you are in.
Example, Michigan has a Concealed PISTOL license, and also recognizes permits from all other states. But Michigan law only allows for the carrying of concealed PISTOLS and not WEAPONS in general. Therefore, a Florida resident carrying a handgun in Michigan is ok, but a Florida resident carrying brass knuckles is a no-no in Michigan.
Unlike NY/NJ and a few other states, most allow citizens and non citizens to openly carry a handgun without any permit. The state of Colorado doesn't give a rats butt if you need a permit to posses/carry/transport a handgun in NY or NJ, all they care about is that you follow Colorado's laws.
VT works the same way, they don't care if I have 20 permits, or none, as long as I follow the laws of VT. Since VT doesn't prohibit persons from carrying a handgun, anybody (law abiding of course) can.
The only ones I wouldn't be sure on are those jurisdictions that place restrictions on concealed licenses. Usually they are seen in "may issue" states. Would Utah recognize a permit from Iowa that's restricted to hunting and target shooting only as a fully authorized permit in their state? I don't know.
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SGT Jensen
State Researcher
| Joined: | Sat Feb 24th, 2007 |
| Location: | Santaquin, Utah USA |
| Posts: | 1990 |
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Posted: Sun Jun 21st, 2009 07:33 pm |
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Yooper wrote: The only ones I wouldn't be sure on are those jurisdictions that place restrictions on concealed licenses. Usually they are seen in "may issue" states. Would Utah recognize a permit from Iowa that's restricted to hunting and target shooting only as a fully authorized permit in their state? I don't know.
...since you used Utah as an example. 
Utah will honor a "permit to carry a concealed firearm" issued by any State or County.
76-10-523. Persons exempt from weapons laws.
(2) The provisions of Subsections 76-10-504(1) and (2) ,[concealed carry] and Section 76-10-505 [loaded carry and school zones] do not apply to any person to whom a permit to carry a concealed firearm has been issued:
(a) pursuant to Section 53-5-704; or
(b) by another state or county.
Now, I realize that every State has a different title printed on the card, but Utah chose the wording to match what is printed on our card.
That being said, law enforcement here does not seem to care. As long as you have some kind of "gun permit" Utah will likely honor it. 
Last edited on Sun Jun 21st, 2009 07:35 pm by SGT Jensen
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Smurfologist
Regular Member
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Posted: Sun Jun 21st, 2009 09:52 pm |
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SGT Jensen wrote: Yooper wrote: The only ones I wouldn't be sure on are those jurisdictions that place restrictions on concealed licenses. Usually they are seen in "may issue" states. Would Utah recognize a permit from Iowa that's restricted to hunting and target shooting only as a fully authorized permit in their state? I don't know.
...since you used Utah as an example.
Utah will honor a "permit to carry a concealed firearm" issued by any State or County.
76-10-523. Persons exempt from weapons laws.
(2) The provisions of Subsections 76-10-504(1) and (2) ,[concealed carry] and Section 76-10-505 [loaded carry and school zones] do not apply to any person to whom a permit to carry a concealed firearm has been issued:
(a) pursuant to Section 53-5-704; or
(b) by another state or county.
Now, I realize that every State has a different title printed on the card, but Utah chose the wording to match what is printed on our card.
That being said, law enforcement here does not seem to care. As long as you have some kind of "gun permit" Utah will likely honor it.
Sounds like you are not sure, SGT Jensen (of course, I am playing devil's advocate). However, I do understand what you are trying to convey.
The 2nd Amendment... brought to you by Beretta and the number 1787!!
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JoeSparky
Centurion Member
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Posted: Mon Jun 22nd, 2009 05:17 am |
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Smurfologist wrote: SGT Jensen wrote: Yooper wrote: The only ones I wouldn't be sure on are those jurisdictions that place restrictions on concealed licenses. Usually they are seen in "may issue" states. Would Utah recognize a permit from Iowa that's restricted to hunting and target shooting only as a fully authorized permit in their state? I don't know.
...since you used Utah as an example.
Utah will honor a "permit to carry a concealed firearm" issued by any State or County.
76-10-523. Persons exempt from weapons laws.
(2) The provisions of Subsections 76-10-504(1) and (2) ,[concealed carry] and Section 76-10-505 [loaded carry and school zones] do not apply to any person to whom a permit to carry a concealed firearm has been issued:
(a) pursuant to Section 53-5-704; or
(b) by another state or county.
Now, I realize that every State has a different title printed on the card, but Utah chose the wording to match what is printed on our card.
That being said, law enforcement here does not seem to care. As long as you have some kind of "gun permit" Utah will likely honor it.
Sounds like you are not sure, SGT Jensen (of course, I am playing devil's advocate). However, I do understand what you are trying to convey.
The 2nd Amendment... brought to you by Beretta and the number 1787!!
If SGT Jensen will forgive me...
I will assume that SGT Jensen does not know EVERY LEO in the State of Utah. I do not! For those that we DO know... MOST have been reasonable and willing to learn. A few have not but those for the most part seem to be from the SALT LAKE COUNTY REGIONS!
I personally know several LEO's in Utah County and have not had any issues regarding open carrying from those that I know.
As much as you seem to want us to make an absolute statement that every LEO in the state is completely knowledgeable about ALL the nuances regarding Open Carry.... I am not willing to say that.
I do hope that knowledge, understanding, and appreciation is growing among both sides of this issue... the side of the citizen (not violating the law) and the officer (not violating our rights, civil and otherwise!
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SGT Jensen
State Researcher
| Joined: | Sat Feb 24th, 2007 |
| Location: | Santaquin, Utah USA |
| Posts: | 1990 |
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Posted: Mon Jun 22nd, 2009 06:05 am |
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Smurfologist wrote: Sounds like you are not sure, SGT Jensen (of course, I am playing devil's advocate). However, I do understand what you are trying to convey.
You're right, I am not sure. I don't know if it was the Legislatures intention to honor any type of permit from any possible issuing authority.
I do know that it is understood that we welcome all who are armed, and don't really care what is printed on your card.
Our gun laws here are very relaxed, and for the most part, so is our law enforcement when it comes to concealed carry.
Flash them some kind of "gun permit", and they will probably be cool with it. ...unless you find that one a-hole!
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Smurfologist
Regular Member
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Posted: Tue Jun 23rd, 2009 02:01 am |
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SGT Jensen wrote: Smurfologist wrote: Sounds like you are not sure, SGT Jensen (of course, I am playing devil's advocate). However, I do understand what you are trying to convey.
You're right, I am not sure. I don't know if it was the Legislatures intention to honor any type of permit from any possible issuing authority.
I do know that it is understood that we welcome all who are armed, and don't really care what is printed on your card.
Our gun laws here are very relaxed, and for the most part, so is our law enforcement when it comes to concealed carry.
Flash them some kind of "gun permit", and they will probably be cool with it. ...unless you find that one a-hole!
Now, I definitely know what you were conveying. Stay safe!!
The 2nd Amendment... brought to you by Beretta and the number 1787!!
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HessMan1075
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Jul 24th, 2009 03:34 pm |
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Let's go Swank!! Time to Shoot
Just Got my Pistol Permit Yesterday, Went and Picked up my first Gun( S&W9mm )
Gonna Shoot in Vermont for the First time, this weekend..
Watch Out!! \
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