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Mike
Super Moderator
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Posted: Sat Sep 13th, 2008 03:28 am |
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WVCDL wrote: skispcs wrote: I was reading that South Carolina was being dropped from Virginia's Reciprocity because SC did not have 24/7 Validation of CHP Permits.
Does Virginia have 24/7 Validation?
I believe that a Virginia LEO could look you up and see this in their computer system, but what if I am traveling in North Carolina and get pulled.
How would the NC LEO verify my permit if needed?
Nevada (Nev. Rev. Stat. § 202.3689(1)), Virginia (Va. Code § 18.2-308(P)), and West Virginia (W.Va. Code § 61-7-6a(d)(2)) are the only states whose reciprocity/recognition laws require a reciprocal/recognized state to have instant verification capabilities. Minnesota has made verification capabilities a part of its analysis of whether a state has equivalent licensing standards.
As Mike indicated in a post above, a license/permit card is prima facie evidence of licensure, and most states do not require more.
The whole issue of whether a person might forge a permit or carry on a revoked permit is so rare in practice that the argument that we need to maintain the 24/7 verification requirement in our reciprocity law to guard against these incidents is without merit. Every jurisdiction, regardless of whether it has a centralized license/permit database, can examine its records and ascertain within no more than a few days whether a purported license or permit is valid. Every law-enforcement officer can run an instant background check on a person to determine whether that person is prohibited by law from possessing firearms and arrest a prohibited possessor regardless of whether that person claims to have a CHP (or equivalent).
Great analysis! Plus, in practice, do police even run 24/7 checks? i know they do not at the VA General Assembly!
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Grapeshot
Founder's Club Member
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Posted: Sat Sep 13th, 2008 11:46 pm |
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Mike wrote:Great analysis! Plus, in practice, do police even run 24/7 checks? i know they do not at the VA General Assembly!
Excellant point Mike. You got a good nights sleep last night, eh. 
But we did get a face to face conversation with the Chief! 
The're still making rules up as they go along.
Yata hey
Last edited on Thu Sep 18th, 2008 04:11 pm by Grapeshot
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340mopar
Regular Member
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Posted: Thu Sep 18th, 2008 03:53 pm |
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SC does have a 24/7 check system. The new folks at SLED gave out the wrong info and got us dropped.
Our people with Grass roots got the ball rolling and VA and SC were in chat mode.
Last I heard VA had given a thumbs up and put it back to SLED for total Reciprocity.
They can drop us in a heartbeat, but how long will it take to get back on?
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WVCDL
State Researcher
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Posted: Thu Sep 18th, 2008 05:59 pm |
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Mike wrote: WVCDL wrote: Nevada (Nev. Rev. Stat. § 202.3689(1)), Virginia (Va. Code § 18.2-308(P)), and West Virginia (W.Va. Code § 61-7-6a(d)(2)) are the only states whose reciprocity/recognition laws require a reciprocal/recognized state to have instant verification capabilities. Minnesota has made verification capabilities a part of its analysis of whether a state has equivalent licensing standards.
As Mike indicated in a post above, a license/permit card is prima facie evidence of licensure, and most states do not require more.
The whole issue of whether a person might forge a permit or carry on a revoked permit is so rare in practice that the argument that we need to maintain the 24/7 verification requirement in our reciprocity law to guard against these incidents is without merit. Every jurisdiction, regardless of whether it has a centralized license/permit database, can examine its records and ascertain within no more than a few days whether a purported license or permit is valid. Every law-enforcement officer can run an instant background check on a person to determine whether that person is prohibited by law from possessing firearms and arrest a prohibited possessor regardless of whether that person claims to have a CHP (or equivalent).
Great analysis! Plus, in practice, do police even run 24/7 checks? i know they do not at the VA General Assembly!
Unfortunately, I can now speak from personal experience. If they do, it's rare.
I was stopped on I-66 west near Front Royal this past Sunday by a state trooper for 79/65 and a radar detector.
I pulled well off to the side to leave plenty of space between my vehicle and traffic. I rolled down my window, turned off the engine, kept my hands on the steering wheel, followed his directions and, when I began removing my driver's license from my wallet, also removed my CHL and informed him I had a permit and was presently carrying. He asked and I told him where I was carrying. He politely asked me to exit the vehicle. He slowly removed the gun from my IWB holster, laid it on the driver's seat, and has me come to his car (much better than leaving me outside in the 94-degree heat). He reviewed my licenses, registration, and insurance card. He did not check either my DL or CHL, nor did he run a plate check on my vehicle. I then asked him about how to handle my gun when I got back to my vehicle (since he laid it on my seat), and he told me just to reholster it normally but have my holster & gun facing him as I reholster before getting back into my vehicle.
I didn't ask, but he let me go with a ticket only for the radar detector and did not confiscate it (he did ask me to lock it up until I got out of Virginia). So I'm going to be out $101 but it is my first ticket in 5 years. At least I won't have to worry about fighting the WV DMV over whether the 79/65 I could have gotten should be kept off my license record pursuant to W.Va. Code 17C-6-1(j), not to mention the extra $70 that it would have added to the check I am about to write to the Warren County General District Court.
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Racerman
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri May 8th, 2009 08:14 pm |
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Here is my incident. I too came out ahead. I was traveling through SC on may way to FL one night and an unmarked SC trooper clocked me at 82/70. When pulled over, he came to my right passenger window and asked for my DL and Reg. The Reg was in the glove compartment along with a Ruger 45 handgun.
I never attempted to reach for the papers and instead told him I had a holstered handgun in the glove compartment. He said OK, please open the box. I did and he asked for the gun (for my safety and yours was the way he put it), which I gave him handle first.
He left and came back with a ticket for the speeding, my unloaded gun and clip and gave me everything back. He thanked me for telling him about the gun and after I received the ticket told me where to call to ask for a reduction in the fine and to not have the offense shared with my state, FL. It all worked great, I did get a reduction and the points never showed up on my FL license.
The moral is, if you are legal, be up front. I was polite and mature about it and he appreciated it. This was one of the better LEO I have run into and I sent a letter of support to the SC Highway patrol about him. Unfortunately, he was called back into the Marines and was killed in Iraq later on. What a waste.
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