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BJA
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 04:34 pm |
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I have been calling for the last two days about how Milwaukee COunty ordinance 47.05 is in non-compliandce with state statute 66.0409.
State statute 66.0409
66.0409. Local regulation of firearms.
(1) In this section:
(a) "Firearm" has the meaning given in s.
167.31 (1) (c).
(b) "Political subdivision" means a city,
village, town or county.
(c) "Sport shooting range" means an area designed and operated for the practice of weapons used in hunting, skeet shooting and similar sport shooting.
(2) Except as provided in subs. (3) and (4), no political subdivision may enact an ordinance or adopt a resolution that regulates the sale, purchase, purchase delay, transfer, ownership, use, keeping, possession, bearing, transportation, licensing, permitting, registration or taxation of any firearm or part of a firearm, including ammunition and reloader components, unless the ordinance or resolution is the same as or similar to, and no more stringent than, a state statute.
(3)(a) Nothing in this section prohibits a county from imposing a sales tax or use tax under subchapter V of chapter 77 on any firearm or part of a firearm, including ammunition and reloader components, sold in the county.
(b) Nothing in this section prohibits a city, village or town that is authorized to exercise village powers under s. 60.22 (3) from enacting an ordinance or adopting a resolution that restricts the discharge of a firearm.
(4)(a) Nothing in this section prohibits a political subdivision from continuing to enforce an ordinance or resolution that is in effect on November 18, 1995, and that regulates the sale, purchase, transfer, ownership, use, keeping, possession, bearing, if the ordinance or resolution is the same as or similar to, and no more stringent than, a state statute. transportation, licensing, permitting, registration or taxation of any firearm or part of a firearm, including ammunition and reloader components,
(am) Nothing in this section prohibits a political subdivision from continuing to enforce until November 30, 1998, an ordinance or resolution that is in effect on November 18, 1995, and that requires a waiting period of not more than 7 days for the purchase of a handgun.
(b) If a political subdivision has in effect on November 17, 1995, an ordinance or resolution that regulates the sale, purchase, transfer, ownership, use, keeping, possession, bearing, transportation, licensing, permitting, registration or
taxation of any firearm or part of a firearm, including ammunition and reloader components, and the ordinance or resolution is not the same as or similar to a state statute, the ordinance or resolution shall have no legal effect and the political subdivision may not enforce the ordinance or resolution on or after November 18, 1995.
(c) Nothing in this section prohibits a political subdivision from enacting and enforcing a zoning ordinance that regulates the new construction of a sport shooting range or when the expansion of an existing sport shooting range would impact public health and safety.
(5) A county ordinance that is enacted or a county resolution that is adopted by a county under sub. (2) or a county ordinance or resolution that remains in effect under sub. (4) (a) or (am) applies only in those towns in the county that have not enacted an ordinance or adopted a resolution under sub. (2) or that continue to enforce an ordinance or resolution under sub. (4) (a) or (am), except that this subsection does not apply to a sales or use tax that is imposed under subchapter V of chapter 77.
Milwaukee county ordinance 47.05
Use of firearms and fireworks; hunting with bow and arrow; trapping. No person shall carry, fire or discharge any gun, pistol or firearm, nor any rocket, torpedo or other fireworks of any description, nor shall any person engage in trapping within any park or parkway without a written permit of the department of parks, recreation and culture; nor shall any person hunt with bow and arrow within any park or parkway. No person shall carry, fire or discharge any gun, pistol or firearm, nor any rocket, torpedo or other fireworks of any description upon any premises owed or leased by Milwaukee County which is not part of the county parks and parkways. The word "gun" shall include airgun.
Now some people say that it is similar to the state park statute but in fact it is way more restrictive. You can't possess a gun at all in a county par, which is a total gun ban while the state park statute states you may carry a gun ANYTIME as long as it is unloaded and encased. Also there is a huge difference between county and state parks!! Not to mention we have 99 state parks and 120 or so M. CTY parks.
Here is the state park statute
29.089(2) 
(3)'] no person may have in his or her possession or under his or her control a firearm on land located in state parks or state fish hatcheries unless the firearm is unloaded and enclosed within a carrying case.
PLEAE CALL, I have been working hard at finding what the hell is going on!!
Last edited on Thu Jun 4th, 2009 02:00 pm by BJA
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BJA
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 04:37 pm |
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Here are the numbers to call
(414) 278-4646.
District Attorney: Mr. John T. Chisholm
Phone: 414-278-4211
Scott walker
The staute reads the ordinance or resolution is the same as or similar to, and no more stringent than, a state statute
It is more stringent!!!!
Ben
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Mr. Greg
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 04:49 pm |
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Interesting point.
I'm still waiting on the call back from the Milwaukee County Parks employee who called me yesterday. I think I'll give her a ring again today to see if she has dicovere anything.
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Teej
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Mar 13th, 2008 |
| Location: | Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 213 |
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Offline
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 05:33 pm |
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No torpedos?! awww, there goes my fun at the park lagoon.
But seriously...
STATE law says you cannot go in a STATE park armed.
It does NOT say you cannot go in a park owned by the state or any political subdivision thereof.
Contrast that with the gov't buildings statute which DOES specify that you can't go armed in a building owned by the state "or any political subdivision thereof."
Therefore any ordinance that references county or muni parks...is more stringent.
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BJA
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 05:39 pm |
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3)'] no person may have in his or her possession or under his or her control a firearm on land located in state parks or state fish hatcheries unless the firearm is unloaded and enclosed within a carrying case.
You can carry a gun around in state parks you just have to follow the procedure above.
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Mr. Greg
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 05:51 pm |
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BJA wrote: 3)'] no person may have in his or her possession or under his or her control a firearm on land located in state parks or state fish hatcheries unless the firearm is unloaded and enclosed within a carrying case.
You can carry a gun around in state parks you just have to follow the procedure above.
Yeah, that's my understanding as well. Kind of hard to have a open carry picnic while walking around with pistol cases, though. 
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Rick Finsta
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 08:22 pm |
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Besides, carrying a pistol in a case is CCW, which is prohibited.
Gotta love our legislature and judiciary in WI!
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P.I. Guy
Regular Member
| Joined: | Fri Apr 24th, 2009 |
| Location: | Wanker County |
| Posts: | 33 |
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 08:29 pm |
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BJA wrote: Open carry illegal in Milwaukee County Parks
No @#$% Sherlock....
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Teej
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Mar 13th, 2008 |
| Location: | Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 213 |
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 08:42 pm |
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welcome back, bunker.
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Mr. Greg
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 08:44 pm |
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P.I. Guy wrote: BJA wrote: Open carry illegal in Milwaukee County Parks
No @#$% Sherlock....
Is that you, Bunker ol buddy? 
How'd Good old JB's opinion on Monday treat you?
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P.I. Guy
Regular Member
| Joined: | Fri Apr 24th, 2009 |
| Location: | Wanker County |
| Posts: | 33 |
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Posted: Fri Apr 24th, 2009 11:17 pm |
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| Wow, I point out the obvious and get accusations in return. What a intelligent bunch here.
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Nutczak
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Apr 25th, 2009 12:10 am |
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P.I guy,
A little background, you have added nothing but deragoatory statements in your brief time here, No introduction, no nothing. There is a guy who used the name "Bunker" in one of his trolling attempts that did nothing but argue on this site and started and typed out nothing but his emotions instead of anything that could be considered fact.
You are currently emulatiing "Bunker" and doing a darn good job with your few posts,
So whats the deal? Are you pro 2A, or anti 2A, maybe if you were to state your intentions and add some verifiable facts to the discussion, you may recieve a warmer welcome.
Are you looking for intelligent banter, or just here to be a troll?
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Teej
Regular Member
| Joined: | Thu Mar 13th, 2008 |
| Location: | Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 213 |
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Offline
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Posted: Sat Apr 25th, 2009 01:05 am |
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P.I. Guy wrote: Wow, I point out the obvious and get accusations in return. What a intelligent bunch here.
The only thing I saw you do was cut & paste someone's topic, boldface it, and add a smartass "No @#$^ sherlock"
Now if I'm somehow misinterpreting you, I'll gladly apologize. But the reason I said welcome back bunker is because this bunker character used to make all kinds of posts swearing up and down that he knew for fact things that are now clearly and absolutely proven false.
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smithman
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Apr 25th, 2009 01:31 am |
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"if the ordinance or resolution is the same as or similar to, AND no more stringent than, a state statute."
Both of these underlined statements have to be in place in order for the premption to work, due to the AND. Unfortunately the "similar to" seems to be the weasel word here.
At the very least, they cannot redefine "airgun" to be a "firearm" in the last sentence.
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Rick Finsta
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Apr 25th, 2009 05:32 am |
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| State Parks are not municipal parks, nor are they similar.
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BJA
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Sat Apr 25th, 2009 04:12 pm |
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So what can we do?? I have been caling as I stated before, and hoping they repeal it. But who gets held accountable for not being in comliance with state law!? What is the next course of actions?
Isn't there any accountability in our government? 
Ben
Last edited on Sat Apr 25th, 2009 04:13 pm by BJA
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Rick Finsta
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Apr 25th, 2009 05:32 pm |
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The issue here is that the state law (66.0409) did not force subdivisions of the state to purge their unenforceable laws, nor did it make it illegal for such laws to exist. It simply made it illegal to enforce such laws. I say, to use the MPD Chief's own words, that we act against such laws with "impunity," as state law allows.
For instance, Saukville still has a total prohibition on firearms possession unless such firearms are unloaded and encased (even going so far as to have no exemption for the home), though they know they can't enforce it. One of these days I'll get it taken out of the municipal code, but it's not high on my list right now as it's really just aesthetics.
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BJA
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Sat Apr 25th, 2009 06:04 pm |
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| Well the thing is though that I talked to the milwaukee county sheriffs department and they said they will enforce it.
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Rick Finsta
Regular Member
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Posted: Sun Apr 26th, 2009 03:18 pm |
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BJA wrote: Well the thing is though that I talked to the milwaukee county sheriffs department and they said they will enforce it.
OK, so they've given away their qualified immunity to a federal lawsuit. This is really no different than carrying openly under the threat of being "put on the ground;" both are illegal actions by the police, and so far, the Milwaukee Sheriff's Department has only threatened to do these things.
I'm not going to tell anyone to "go ahead and do it to see what happens;" having a bunch of cops with hard-ons for their own authority pointing guns at you so you can show them they're wrong in court is not what I'd call the safest plan. It might just be the best way to remind them that YOU are in charge, they only work for you, however. Another good idea is to send letters to your legislators, and copy in the Sheriff and Milwaukee DA. Perhaps contacting a civil rights attorney, and speaking to them about it would behoove you. You could also consider an en masse stroll through some parks with cameras; in Brad's case (the Channel 12 interview), the police seemeed VERY reluctant to be on film detaining someone illegally.
Unfortunately, police have been given far too much leeway for far too long in these matters, and people have just gone along with it. This is not going to change overnight, or in a week, or in a month.
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BJA
Campaign Veteran
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Posted: Wed Jun 17th, 2009 12:06 am |
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Okay, so I just found out that this ordinance covers ALL county property not just parks......... I don't know how I missed it.
47.05. Use of firearms, fireworks; hunting with bow and arrow and trapping; throwing of missiles; making of fires; deposit or breakage of tin cans, bottles and glassware; prohibitions.
(1) Use of firearms and fireworks; hunting with bow and arrow; trapping. No person shall carry, fire or discharge any gun, pistol or firearm, nor any rocket, torpedo or other fireworks of any description, nor shall any person engage in trapping within any park or parkway without a written permit of the department of parks, recreation and culture; nor shall any person hunt with bow and arrow within any park or parkway. No person shall carry, fire or discharge any gun, pistol or firearm, nor any rocket, torpedo or other fireworks of any description upon any premises owed or leased by Milwaukee County which is not part of the county parks and parkways. The word "gun" shall include airgun.
Ben
Last edited on Wed Jun 17th, 2009 12:09 am by BJA
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