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stone789
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Posted: Fri Sep 4th, 2009 12:27 am |
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| TY VERY much for the info and i will be useing the info for myself . i live in clarkston wa. and they are tuff here as far as police so i need the laws to verify if im in trouble. ty again.
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RayeHawk
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Posted: Fri Sep 18th, 2009 12:03 am |
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Hi, Guys (& Gals, I guess, but we're few and far between here) -
I just made a trip to Colo (2 day drive) and OC'd most of the trip.
Upon my return, a friend remarked that you have to have CPL to carry openly in WA, effectively, because iof the locked case in vehicle bit.
And on reading today, I believe that means that if there is not a round in the chamber, it's legal.
So, can I carry with the *bidness* chamber empty?
And yes, I'm a girl 
Rachel
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FMCDH
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Sep 18th, 2009 12:21 am |
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RayeHawk wrote: So, can I carry with the *bidness* chamber empty?
And yes, I'm a girl
Rachel
Welcome to OCDO Rachel,
You must first look at the definition of loaded in the RCWs
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.010
Then the RCW by which carrying a loaded pistol in a vehicle is illegal without a CPL
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.050
You can see by reading both of these, that simply keeping the camber empty but the loaded magazine in the gun, you would be in violation while you are in a vehicle, but no such restriction applies when you are out of the vehicle. You simply cannot have it concealed.
Only by keeping the chamber empty and the magazines separate from the pistol are you in compliance by the letter of the law while in a vehicle.
That being said, many would argue that you are stretching your luck in Washington if you do anything less than have the gun, or ammo and or both locked out of direct access while you are in a vehicle and do not have a permit.
While you can follow the letter of the law simply by keeping the ammo separate from the pistol (such as in a mag holder preferably on the opposite side of your body), its up to you to decide how much risk you are willing to take.
Keep in mind that the pistol, loaded or not, must remain clearly visible without a CPL. You can do a search of the threads to find more conversation on that topic as it has been covered over and over again.
Also, please check the FAQ for the Washington forum, as most general questions such as yours have already been answered for easy reference.
Not that it matters if you are "a girl" or not, but its nice to see more woman taking their own safety seriously.
Again, welcome.
Last edited on Fri Sep 18th, 2009 12:28 am by FMCDH
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RayeHawk
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Posted: Sat Sep 19th, 2009 12:59 am |
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FMCDH wrote: RayeHawk wrote: So, can I carry with the *bidness* chamber empty?
And yes, I'm a girl
Rachel
Welcome to OCDO Rachel,
You must first look at the definition of loaded in the RCWs
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.010
Then the RCW by which carrying a loaded pistol in a vehicle is illegal without a CPL
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.050
You can see by reading both of these, that simply keeping the camber empty but the loaded magazine in the gun, you would be in violation while you are in a vehicle, but no such restriction applies when you are out of the vehicle. You simply cannot have it concealed.
Only by keeping the chamber empty and the magazines separate from the pistol are you in compliance by the letter of the law while in a vehicle.
Thanks, FMDCH - I'm actually in Kenmore, myself.
But the reason I asked is *because* I HAVE read the RCW -
(9) "Loaded" means:
(a) There is a cartridge in the chamber of the firearm;
(b) Cartridges are in a clip that is locked in place in the firearm;
(c) There is a cartridge in the cylinder of the firearm, if the firearm is a revolver;
Since the firearm in question is a revolver, no round in cylinder = not loaded. Five live, and one empty should fit the definition of not loaded.
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joeroket
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Sep 19th, 2009 01:21 am |
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| No, five live and one empty does not fit the definition of loaded because all five are in the cylinder. Last edited on Sat Sep 19th, 2009 01:21 am by joeroket
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FMCDH
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Sep 19th, 2009 01:37 am |
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joeroket wrote: No, five live and one empty does not fit the definition of loaded because all five are in the cylinder.
Exactly.
For the case of a revolver, any in the cylinder and you are considered loaded.
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FMCDH
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Sep 19th, 2009 01:44 am |
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RayeHawk wrote:
Thanks, FMDCH - I'm actually in Kenmore, myself.
Thats great neighbor!
If you shop at the Safeway at all, you probably have seen me, and I normally OC during anything that would be considered "good" weather. Just look for a blond/brown haired guy who looks like a cop, wearing blue jeans and a black or blue t-shirt with a S&W M&P in a black leather DeSantis holster.
Feel free to say Hi! 
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joeroket
Regular Member
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Posted: Sat Sep 19th, 2009 02:38 am |
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FMCDH wrote:
joeroket wrote: No, five live and one empty does not fit the definition of loaded because all five are in the cylinder.
Exactly.
For the case of a revolver, any in the cylinder and you are considered loaded.
It would be nice if they at least let us run Utah loaded with no permit.
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amzbrady
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Oct 16th, 2009 06:14 am |
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ok, I may be a simpleton, but I like things in laymens terms. I have read the rcw's and dont like them. I would like someone to clarify a few things for me. I have posted this before and got frustrated with reply's posting the rcw's to me. please replay and refrain from rcw's.
#1, in a vehicle, you must have a cpl and I do, to carry loaded. Can I strap a holster to the underside of my steering wheel and carry loaded, or on my door pocket? Can I just toss the handgun on the dash, or under the seat or on the seat next to me? I know you have to lock the weapon down when you leave the vehicle and go someplace you can not carry, like the post office or the bar.
#2, How much of a handgun has to be concealed to make it concealed? I C/C w/ an IWB and the but of the gun sticks out with part of the slide.
Like I said I'm a simpleton and hate to read, a Dr. Suess style book on Carry etiquette, with pictures would be perfect for me. I would like to carry, in a car. I would like to carry in a bar, I would like to carry my gun, When I carry, I want to have fun...
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sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
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Posted: Fri Oct 16th, 2009 03:27 pm |
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amzbrady wrote: ok, I may be a simpleton, but I like things in laymens terms. I have read the rcw's and dont like them. I would like someone to clarify a few things for me. I have posted this before and got frustrated with reply's posting the rcw's to me. please replay and refrain from rcw's.
#1, in a vehicle, you must have a cpl and I do, to carry loaded. Can I strap a holster to the underside of my steering wheel and carry loaded, or on my door pocket? Can I just toss the handgun on the dash, or under the seat or on the seat next to me? I know you have to lock the weapon down when you leave the vehicle and go someplace you can not carry, like the post office or the bar.
#2, How much of a handgun has to be concealed to make it concealed? I C/C w/ an IWB and the but of the gun sticks out with part of the slide.
Like I said I'm a simpleton and hate to read, a Dr. Suess style book on Carry etiquette, with pictures would be perfect for me. I would like to carry, in a car. I would like to carry in a bar, I would like to carry my gun, When I carry, I want to have fun...
I am with you on having things in layman terms. Through this site and reading the rcw's I have had a lot better understanding.
1. If you have your cpl It doesnt matter where you put it in the car, just like it wouldn't matter where you would carry it on yourself. So carry or put it where ever is the most convenient for you.
2. Is a trickier question, because you are concealing but part of it is exposed, wich could lead to situations of LEO's demanding to see your cpl. In my opinion, you shouldn't give them reason to ask. From what I have discerned and I could be wrong, concealed would be if you can't immediatley percieve it as a fire arm, but I personally play it safe and if I conceal its totally concealed ( sometimes I print though), or I make sure it is totally open, so as not to have any gray areas. As to what my intentions are.
I definately am not a lawyer, so these are my personal opinions and what I percieve from what I have read.
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kito109654
Regular Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 3rd, 2009 06:45 pm |
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First off, to the OP, thanks for the great breakdown of information. Sometimes reading those RCWs makes my head spin.
sudden valley gunner wrote:
1. If you have your cpl It doesnt matter where you put it in the car, just like it wouldn't matter where you would carry it on yourself. So carry or put it where ever is the most convenient for you.
I definately am not a lawyer, so these are my personal opinions and what I percieve from what I have read.
That is not what I understand to be the law when reading RCW 9.41.050 2a.
(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
So I would say it's not okay to put it in the door or affix it anywhere in the vehicle or have it on the seat next to you or the dash. You may keep it on you. Even just having it out of it's holster and sitting in your lap would be a gray area in my eyes.
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joeroket
Regular Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 3rd, 2009 08:29 pm |
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kito109654 wrote: First off, to the OP, thanks for the great breakdown of information. Sometimes reading those RCWs makes my head spin.
sudden valley gunner wrote:
1. If you have your cpl It doesnt matter where you put it in the car, just like it wouldn't matter where you would carry it on yourself. So carry or put it where ever is the most convenient for you.
I definately am not a lawyer, so these are my personal opinions and what I percieve from what I have read.
That is not what I understand to be the law when reading RCW 9.41.050 2a.
(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
So I would say it's not okay to put it in the door or affix it anywhere in the vehicle or have it on the seat next to you or the dash. You may keep it on you. Even just having it out of it's holster and sitting in your lap would be a gray area in my eyes.
You are reading it wrong. If you meet i, ii, or iii then you are in compliance with the law. As long as you are in the vehicle with the loaded pistol and you have a CPL then there is no violation of .050.
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kito109654
Regular Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 01:32 am |
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| Right you are! I see that now, thanks for clearing it up for me.
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joeroket
Regular Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 01:52 am |
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kito109654 wrote:
Right you are! I see that now, thanks for clearing it up for me.
Piece of cake. Thats why we are all here, to learn and educate.
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