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OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum > Stories From The States > Florida > So, How's That 90-Day Approval Working For You?
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| OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum > Stories From The States > Florida > So, How's That 90-Day Approval Working For You?
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smoking357 Banned 
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Are all of you getting approved within your 90-day window? You know you are within your rights to serve them with a default letter. Are any of you doing it? Imagine what will happen if you play all nicey-nice, and let them walk all over you, wait 120 days, or more, and they come back with some deficiency that causes you to wait, even longer? Won't you feel like a chump then, when you could have solved the matter, up front, with a default letter? They're breaking the rules, the very rules they created and force you to play by. Don't be a wimp and hurt fellow gun owners by keeping silent. Stand up for yourselves. If you won't stand up for yourselves by filing a default letter, will anyone ever think you gun owners will stand up to serious governmental transgressions? Scroll down a few posts. A draft letter is already written. Last edited on Wed Apr 1st, 2009 08:20 pm by smoking357 |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member 
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It's been a month and they still have not cashed my check. There is no reason getting a firearm permit should take so long, with all of this wonderful technology we have in the USA. |
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smoking357 Banned
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JohnnyBlk45 wrote: It's been a month and they still have not cashed my check. There is no reason getting a firearm permit should take so long, with all of this wonderful technology we have in the USA. Just remember, the date of check cashing is absolutely meaningless. The date of receipt is all that matters under the law. If it's over a month, your file is now complete, and they can't ask you for any further information. |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member
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So now I guess it's just a waiting game. Thanks for the information. |
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sprat Regular Member 
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don't follow the OP's advise just wait it will come, forcing bureaucrats gets you know where besides the OP will not answer the questions he has been asked on this site and others So where in Florida do you live (smoking) and which law school did you attend he won't answer either question sprat |
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smoking357 Banned
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sprat wrote:don't follow the OP's advise just wait it will come, forcing bureaucrats gets you know where If the government won't adhere to its own laws, let's get that fact out in the open, so the citizens can take the next steps. Why are you so interested in my personal details? What sort of grudge are you carrying for being so comprehensively eviscerated? Further, how is my address and my law school germane to the question, which I have briefed in full in these and other pages? If you have quarrel with my argument and gun rights, show the polemic fortitude to fight the matter, straightway. These irrelevant feints are keeping you on the retreat. Just because I dropped you here on and that other forum of Communists hard and like a bad habit, does not justify you coming here and depriving posters of their rights and attacking gun rights with your lies. Truth is the currency here. Take your lies back to that forum of traitors where you enemies of freedom can talk about how open carry worries you and where you discuss ridiculous and meaningless topics such as "date of check cashing," "Wal-Mart walks," and "printing." Are you a charter member of the Brady Campaign? |
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MarlboroLts5150 Regular Member 
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If your talking about a carry permit, is Fl a "shall-issue" or "may-issue" state? Here in hawaii, we are a may-issue state, thats how the local PD gets away with not issuing any permits. We are trying to get that changed here. |
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Glock23-4-Me Regular Member 
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shall issue |
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MarlboroLts5150 Regular Member
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So Fl is just seriously draggin' their feet. |
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fridaddy Regular Member
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MarlboroLts5150 wrote: So Fl is just seriously draggin' their feet.No just paranoid reactionary increase in applications due to the election. I really believe they are doing everything they can to comply with the law, just too little too late. |
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keymo Regular Member
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Submitted application, received by Licensing on 20 Jan 2009. Issued permit on 13 April 2009 (just a few days shy of 90). Of course it took until the 20th to show up in the mail, but I agree with the OP and want costs to be kept to a minimim |
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Phssthpok Regular Member
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Just a heads up....you Florida folks may have to start doing more 'default' filings here pretty soon. |
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smoking357 Banned
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Phssthpok wrote: Just a heads up....you Florida folks may have to start doing more 'default' filings here pretty soon. If DOACS spent the $6 million hiring processors and getting permits timely processed, there wouldn't be cash lying about. The truth is that DOACS was hoarding it and was going to use it for its own purposes which they would strain to call "permit related." I don't like agencies having private funds. All monies should be deposited in the Treasury, and agencies should get their budgets allocated by the Legislature. |
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Task Force 16 Campaign Veteran
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smoking357 wrote: Phssthpok wrote:Just a heads up....you Florida folks may have to start doing more 'default' filings here pretty soon. Depositing all monies into the treasury is what caused the problems with the Social Security System. Did you know that that started out as a separate fund of it's own from the general treasury. Had it remained a separate fund the SSS wouldn't be broke today. |
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David59 Regular Member
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Sent on 1/23/09, cashed check on 2/27/09 and received license today. Thank you Florida for giving me opportunity to get this license. Maybe one day Illinois will have the same rights as you guys have. (license issued 5/04/09) Last edited on Mon May 18th, 2009 01:58 am by David59 |
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Fred Regular Member
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Sent my stuff in on the 2/27/09 called 5/14/09. They said the application was recieved but not processed.  Getting mighty close to the 90 day window.  I would rather get the real thing then sending in a default letter. If you send in a default letter do you get a license issued or is the letter all you get? |
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smoking357 Banned
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Fred wrote: Sent my stuff in on the 2/27/09 called 5/14/09. Once they receive the default letter, you're active. At a point later, your plastic license comes in the mail. Sending the default letter is the cost of Certified Mail or FedEx. Carrying on a default permit is a personal decision, as cops do not understand the law and do not like those who do. If you have concerns about carrying on a default permit, contact fridaddy, a poster here who is a Florida attorney. First, though, review all his posts here on the subject. |
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Fred Regular Member
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Wow, thanks for the info really appreciate it!! |
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smoking357 Banned
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Fred wrote: Wow, thanks for the info really appreciate it!! I see you also post to the Kentucky forum. If you're in Kentucky, do not carry on a Florida default permit. That's too much of a tangle for KY to sort out. Just carry openly there, which is what I would do here if we didn't have this silly permit requirement that makes us pay to exercise our rights. |
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Fred Regular Member
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I don't think I would carry in Florida let alone kentucky with a default letter. I just recently started open carrying in Kentucky. At least were I live everyone is very at ease with it. Doesn't hurt to have a CCW though |
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smoking357 Banned
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Fred wrote: I don't think I would carry in Florida let alone kentucky with a default letter. I'll bet that you've previously carried, several times, and were not aware that you did it. How many times have you tossed a gun in a car or carried a gun to a friend's house, gun shop or gun show? How many times have you carried a gun from your car to your house? How many times have you done the above and had no idea that you did it? Have you ever found that you left a gun in a jacket or a bag? How many of these travels would fall under the definition of "carry?" If nothing else, the default letter gives you that extra bit of protection in case you forget that you're technically "carrying." |
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Fred Regular Member
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Open carry in kentucky is legal without a permit or letter. I was referring to concealed carry. Either way I would personally have reservations about "concealed" carry with a letter written by yourself stating the state took too long to issue you a real license. |
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smoking357 Banned
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Fred wrote: Open carry in kentucky is legal without a permit or letter. I was referring to concealed carry. Either way I would personally have reservations about "concealed" carry with a letter written by yourself stating the state took too long to issue you a real license. Oh, you're a permission-asker. Never mind. Have a nice life. |
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Fred Regular Member
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Easy now, were on the same team . Didn't want to get you upset. Its all good |
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fridaddy Regular Member
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For anyone who still has questions about the legality of the default process, please read the quote from Charles Bronson, Secretary DOACS in the linked article: http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/gubernatorial/article1002099.ece "By law, the department is required to issue licenses within 90 days of receipt of a complete application," Bronson wrote in his letter to Crist dated May 14. "If we do not meet this time frame, an applicant may, by law, request the license to be issued even without the results of the criminal background check being reviewed. We simply cannot process all of these applications in a timely manner because of this unprecedented surge in new applications." He is slightly incorrect in his quote however, as there is no requirement to wait for a reply or the issuance of the license, only proof that the default letter was sent. |
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smoking357 Banned
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fridaddy wrote: For anyone who still has questions about the legality of the default process, please read the quote from Charles Bronson, Secretary DOACS in the linked article: This isn't good for the anti-gun floridaconcealedcarry.com. I'm not a gracioius winner, and they have a whole lot of apologizing to do and a whole lot of crow to eat. |
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FMCDH Regular Member 
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Good news....perhaps for everyone. Strangely enough and by some act of God I am sure, I got my non-resident permit in only 70 days. My application packet was received by FDACS on 05 March and my permit was issued on the 13th of May, I received it today. They must be picking up steam over there, or else something or someone spurred them to stop dragging. Anyway, I'm happy. AND I got my Florida permit before I got my NH permit that was submitted on the 18th of Feb...who would have thought?! lol Last edited on Sat May 23rd, 2009 02:46 am by FMCDH |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member
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Good for you I'm still waiting on my FL permit it's almost 90 days from the time my check was cashed |
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smoking357 Banned
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JohnnyBlk45 wrote: Good for you I'm still waiting on my FL permit it's almost 90 days from the time my check was cashed The date of check cashing is meaningless. The date of receipt is the only date that matters. |
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Ian Lone Star Veteran 
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I've only had my Florida permit for about 6-7 months, now that I'm moving to Colorado I have to go through all that crap again. Oh well, at least I will have open carry now  |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member
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I just received a letter from florida stating that my training certificate needs the instructor license number. It's been about 90 days, you would think they would have sent this awhile ago, this really pisses me off....now it's going to take another 90 days. |
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smoking357 Banned
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JohnnyBlk45 wrote: I just received a letter from florida stating that my training certificate needs the instructor license number. It's been about 90 days, you would think they would have sent this awhile ago, this really pisses me off....now it's going to take another 90 days. If you inform them that their ability to ask any questions expired on Day 30, your file becoming complete on that date, they're more or less compelled to accept the legitimacy of your certificate. You could let the clock run to the 90th day and serve them a default letter that references their failure to speak within 30 days. The letter only costs a stamp. |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member
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smoking357 wrote:JohnnyBlk45 wrote:I just received a letter from florida stating that my training certificate needs the instructor license number. It's been about 90 days, you would think they would have sent this awhile ago, this really pisses me off....now it's going to take another 90 days. I don't want to piss them off, then I may never get it. So by law they have to send me a permit, is that correct? |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member
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I just spoke to the lady in Florida she told me once I send the letter back with the license number it will take an additional 30 - 60 days, what a system  |
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smoking357 Banned
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JohnnyBlk45 wrote: I don't want to piss them off, then I may never get it. So by law they have to send me a permit, is that correct? 1. That's how a conquered people live, hoping not to be noticed by the government. 2. Yep. They may not like it, but 120.60 gives them 30- and 60-day deadlines, the first for completeness, the second for approval or denial. |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member
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smoking357 wrote:JohnnyBlk45 wrote:I don't want to piss them off, then I may never get it. So by law they have to send me a permit, is that correct? I mentioned this to the lady in Florida she said it's not true. |
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JeepSeller Regular Member
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JohnnyBlk45, The Florida Statutes do specify that the State must issue the liscense within 90 days. Due to the overwhelmeing increase in applicants, the state has been running a little over that 90 day time span for some time now. Most people are getting theirs in the 90 to 100 day span. You do have the right to send a letter demanding the liscense issued based on Florida statute after 90 days. It most likely won't get you your's any faster though and since it is required to have that liscense on your person at all times, you will have to wait for it. I'd be carefull following any advice of the contrary. Unfortunately, you've stepped feet first in the middle of a pretty large debate in that regard. There are a few that unwisely believe that after you send your letter demanding issue, that you are legal to carry so long as you have your reciept from FedEx with you. Since FedEx is not in the buisness of issuing Florida liscenses, I'd be wary of that advice. But, don't take my word for it or the certain rebuttal that will follow my comments insulting me and you for even making the comments you've made so far. Go to the "Default" thread in this same Florida section..you can't miss it, it's the longest thread on this board. Do some light reading and decide who's credability you believe for your self. By the time you get done reading THAT thread, your liscense will already be there anyway.  |
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JohnnyBlk45 Regular Member
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JeepSeller wrote:JohnnyBlk45, thanks for the information, I just sent the requested information back to Florida, so I'll just wait for my permit to arrive. I did read some of the thread and it's longggggggggg  . |
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JeepSeller Regular Member
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JohnnyBlk45 wrote:
Yea, it's long and pretty much a waste of your time to really read it now that I think about it. I'll summarize.... The State of Florida is required to issue the permit in 90 days. You are allowed to write the state after that 90 days and request the permit be issued in default of the 90 day statute without further prejudice. The laws of the State of Florida also require a permit holder to have said permit on their person at all times while carrying a concealed weapon. There are those who believe that simply sending that letter and carrying proof of it, such as the reciept and tracking number from FedEx constitutes a legal substitution for that state issued permit as a result of the state's default. Then there are those of us who maintain that those people are wrong and those who believe the FedEx default theory seem to take it very personally and resort to the only tactic they know, insults. It's actually really simple logic in the end. Again, it's up to you to deciide which logic is more reasonable to believe. Personally, while we all know it stinks to have to wait on that stupid piece of plactic to excersise a constitutional right,I think you're wise to do so. Last edited on Fri Jun 19th, 2009 06:18 pm by JeepSeller |
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smoking357 Banned
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JeepSeller wrote: You do have the right to send a letter demanding the liscense issued based on Florida statute after 90 days. Whoa, how much time did you waste on the other side of this question, opposing freedom and attacking gun rights? Now, you try to sneak into admitting what you vociferously denied? Shame on you. Here's what you said: I don't disagree with your post in the sense that the law, as I understand it, is that if the license isn't issued within the prescribed time period, currently 90 days, then you have the right to request a hearing on the subject forcing the state to either approve or deny at said hearing and back up their decision. The polite thing to do now would be to apologize for lying to so many about this. Further, just as with this issue, you'll find that I'm always right. P.S., 120.60 affords him relief from Florida's delay, regardless of his location, while 790.06 has no bearing upon him in Georgia. Don't go spreading misinformation, again. We had to do so much work to set you straight, last time. Last edited on Fri Jun 19th, 2009 08:32 pm by smoking357 |
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JeepSeller Regular Member
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Wow, you really do have a problem with reality, don't you? The question was always about your stance that you could send a letter to the state and then use that letter in substitution for the actual permit issued by the state! No one ever questioned your right to send a letter to the state informing them that they've surpassed the 90 day time limit and request they issue it. Honestly, this is juvenile even for you. Really, is your memory THAT short? You really are smokingsomething aren't you?.. And before you go tattle-telling or you and anyone else go accusing me of personal attacks...just look up a couple posts...I was relaying important, ACCURATE information to a poster in response to a question....YOU joined in with your insulting attitude!! You just really do have an problem with being beaten, don't you? Seriously, man up. Admit you were wrong and stop with the insulting, peronal attacks already! That method of deceptive argument is not only getting old, but, just plain embarassing. No one gives you any credit here as a result...you've gotta be seeing that by now. Even you can't deny it at this point. Last edited on Fri Jun 19th, 2009 08:30 pm by JeepSeller |
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smoking357 Banned
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JeepSeller wrote: Wow, you really do have a problem with reality, don't you? Knock off the personal attacks. I won. It's just the way it shook out. Insulting me isn't going to change history. Last edited on Fri Jun 19th, 2009 08:44 pm by smoking357 |
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JeepSeller Regular Member
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Show me where you were right! You never did prove your case! OH..that's right, you offered up a memo written by the secretary to the gov. And, as I pointed out several times....that memo only proves that there is a 90 day limit...something for which I never argued or anyone else for that matter. I'll ask you again...I'll even caplitalize it to make it easier for you to read and harder for you to ignore......SHOW IN CITE HOW IT SPEAKS IN ANY REGARD TO A DEFAULT LETTER AND THE APPLICANT BEING ABLE TO CARRY BY SIMPLY FIRING OFF A LETTER!! You won't do it...we know you wont' do it..now...insult me again..I'm looking forward to it...since it's all you seem to have... |
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smoking357 Banned
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JeepSeller wrote: Show me where you were right! You never did prove your case! Give it up, already. Gun owners won. Thank me for protecting your freedoms, and move on. The head the issuing agency was forced to make a press release because of my civil rights advocacy, for Pete's sake. ''By law, the department is required to issue licenses within 90 days of receipt of a complete application,'' Bronson wrote in his letter to Crist dated May 14. ``If we do not meet this time frame, an applicant may, by law, request the license to be issued even without the results of the criminal background check being reviewed. We simply cannot process all of these applications in a timely manner because of this unprecedented surge in new applications.'' Barring another case that tops mine, I'll be the Florida firearms advocate of the year in 2009. You're welcome. |
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JeepSeller Regular Member
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Ok...again..read my words for the last time! No one is denying that the state only has 90 days to issue the liscense and the appliant can, after the 90 days, request in writing the state issue said liscens without further prejudice. I still see nowhere in that memo that states that an applicant can carry a concealed firearm in the State of Florida simply because they sent a letter requesting issue! Where is it? Again, a direct question that you'll dodge, ignore, or use insulting language and peronal attacks to misdirect the attention from yourself. Now...go ahead and insult me again to take the attention off your failure to answer a direct question or provide REAL proof of your arguments.. I'm waiting. |
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smoking357 Banned
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JeepSeller wrote: Ok...again..read my words for the last time! No one is denying that the state only has 90 days to issue the liscense and the appliant can, after the 90 days, request in writing the state issue said liscens without further prejudice. What statute says that? |
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JeepSeller Regular Member
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Aww gee...how did I know you'd dodge the question all together! I rest my case. Go away troll. |
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smoking357 Banned
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JeepSeller wrote: Go away troll. I see you've learned not get yourself boxed in again. Mate in four moves, usually, when you dare to play. You usually take a few swipes at Liberty, along the way, and those are good for a laugh. By the way, the phrase "without further prejudice" appears nowhere in Florida Statutes. Making up law, again? Last edited on Sat Jun 20th, 2009 01:11 am by smoking357 |
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JeepSeller Regular Member
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Johnnyblk45, I'm pretty sure the above speaks for itself. I rest my case on the troll and his misinformation. |
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smoking357 Banned
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JeepSeller wrote: Johnnyblk45, I'm pretty sure the above speaks for itself. I rest my case on the troll and his misinformation. Playing the old "win by losing" gambit, I see. |
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Johnny_B Regular Member
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smoking357 wrote:
Mate in two |
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