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OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum > Open Carry Brigade > News & Political Alerts > FBI wants palm prints, eye scans, tattoo mapping
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| OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum > Open Carry Brigade > News & Political Alerts > FBI wants palm prints, eye scans, tattoo mapping
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ama-gi Regular Member 
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http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/02/04/fbi.biometrics/index.html The FBI already has 55 million sets of fingerprints on file. I wonder how many of those are CHP holders. |
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BobCav Founder's Club Member 
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How Orwellian....   |
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Thundar Regular Member 
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The glass citizen is coming soon. |
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vrwmiller Regular Member 
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This is truly scary.... As I read the article, for some reason, I began thinking of the film "Minority Report". Out in public where you can be identified with scanners. A citizen's movements could be tracked with reckless disregard for that citizen's safety. It is certainly still Hoover's FBI. |
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DoubleR Activist Member 
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Here's what was being tested in 2001... Call It Super Bowl Face Scan I 02-02-01-WASHINGTON -- When tens of thousands of football fans packed into a Florida stadium for Super Bowl XXXV, they weren't merely watching the game: They were also being watched. Face-recognition software surreptitiously scanned everyone passing through turnstiles and flashed probable matches with the mugs of known criminals on the screens of a police control room. |
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bohdi Regular Member 
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lol, come to the super bowl, goto jail afterwards. |
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deepdiver Activist Member 
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Our government is just out of control. |
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AbNo Regular Member 
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And people wonder why I don't watch sports... |
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Doug Huffman Regular Member 
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http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum65/8064.html |
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UTOC-45-44 Regular Member 
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ama-gi wrote: http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/02/04/fbi.biometrics/index.html I think this could POSSIBLY be done to people that has a certain high level ciminal record, felons, maybe. I think that they should let the LAW ABIDING Citizes/Residents be. Don't like the idea, but IF compromise is needed. TJ |
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Doug Huffman Regular Member
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Or certain high level clearance. |
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Comp-tech State Researcher 
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Thundar wrote: The glass citizen is coming soon. Even sooner than most people think....... Passports now contain microchip.... http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/1209/p12s01-stct.html Social Security Administration utilizes RFID... http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/techpolicy/2005-01-05-rfid-to-track-ssa_x.htm Ford, GM, Honda and Toyota Spy on Motorists.... http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/12/29/132049.shtml Big Brother Takes the Wheel to Improve Driver Safety.... http://www.ergoweb.com/news/detail.cfm?id=1040 Us clothes firm comes clean on RFID plans.... http://www.silicon.com/research/specialreports/protectingid/0,3800002220,39127337,00.htm "Smart Dust" may soon be watching you.... http://www.king5.com/business/stories/NW_111904SRKsmartdustJK.728df42d.html Deal forged to equip VeriChip with GPS.... http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=42058 These are just "the tip of the iceberg"...... Last edited on Sat Feb 9th, 2008 11:53 pm by Comp-tech |
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ama-gi Regular Member
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UTOC-45-44 wrote: ama-gi wrote:http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/02/04/fbi.biometrics/index.html Apparently, people will never get the fact that what the force on their fellow citizens will someday be forced on them too. If you want to protect your own rights, protect the rights of your neighbor. |
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Tomahawk Regular Member 
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ama-gi wrote: Apparently, people will never get the fact that what the force on their fellow citizens will someday be forced on them too. If you want to protect your own rights, protect the rights of your neighbor. Better spoken by this fellow:
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LEO 229 Regular Member 
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All this complaining about being tracked and monitored... Have you noticed that the stuff containing RFID chips and such are optional items you are not required to carry with you as you walk-about? How about this.... get some animal pelts and make some clothing and carry none of those items and you will be fine. You can be the anonymous citizen among the populace. The day they require me to implant a chip into my body is the day I will join you. Till then I accept the items I may purchase may have RFID chips or tracking devices. What the hell do I care?? The government has my address so if they really want to come get me... they can find me at work or at home. The facial recognition is used to help find honest, law abiding citizens in past years who have since broken a few laws or escaped from prison. The government has no need to know who attended the game... they only want to find the bad people and get them off the streets so the quality of life of those that are good can be enjoyed. Why do paranoia and guns go hand in hand so often??  |
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acrimsontide Regular Member 
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LEO 229 wrote: All this complaining about being tracked and monitored... Come on now LEO229...paranoid, who's paranoid? You know they watch all 300 million of us 24/7. Cameras are everywhere!!!! Heck I hear that they may even start putting mini-cameras in toilet paper so we have no privacy!!! The conspiracy is so great that your dentist may have implanted that micco-chip on your last visit. Everyone is the enemy. I just had a horrible thought....does anyone think that the goverment might be forcing gun manufacturers to put a destructive device in our weapon that the government could use to destroy them at any time they choose? Oh my so much to worry about!!!!!! No I'm not paranoid. (Just having a little fun folks) |
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ama-gi Regular Member
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LEO 229 wrote: The day they require me to implant a chip into my body is the day I will join you. Your son or daughter will be like, "C'mon dad, what's the big deal? Do you have something to hide? It's being implanted so people can steal your identity and to help fight terrorism." |
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Tomahawk Regular Member
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LEO 229 wrote: The day they require me to implant a chip into my body is the day I will join you. QFT |
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MetalChris Regular Member
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Tomahawk wrote: LEO 229 wrote:The day they require me to implant a chip into my body is the day I will join you. +1 |
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LEO 229 Regular Member
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ama-gi wrote: LEO 229 wrote:The day they require me to implant a chip into my body is the day I will join you. Not into altering my body. No tattoos on my forearm and no RFID chips in my body. I am going to have to pass. |
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TheEggman Regular Member 
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'Implanted chips' is not really tinfoil hat mentality. It will start as a voluntary 'for the children' movement. Concerned parents, with all the best intentions will have a chip placed in their newborn at birth. That way, if they ever turn up missing they (or their remains) can be quickly located. It's common practice now with fingerprint and photo programs sponsored by schools and local police in a lot of places. The only thing missing is the chip. In the beginning, of course, the chip could be easily removed by any physician when the child becomes of age, is emancipated, or at any time with the parent's permission. It's only a step or two to legislation that would make removing the chip illegal, like disabling the 'flight recorder' in your own car. Perhaps chips for child molesters, then all felons, then the military, then ... Remember, rights are generally not lost overnight, they slowly erode, one 'reasonable' step at a time. Last edited on Tue Feb 12th, 2008 12:03 am by TheEggman |
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sccrref Regular Member 
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Tomahawk wrote: LEO 229 wrote:The day they require me to implant a chip into my body is the day I will join you. QFT????? I must be stupid or something. |
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ama-gi Regular Member
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LEO 229 wrote: ama-gi wrote:LEO 229 wrote:The day they require me to implant a chip into my body is the day I will join you. Well, you need to get over that selfish impulse in order to provide public safety. The people have spoken and we all have to follow laws we don't like sometimes in order to live in a nation of laws. <sarcasm to make a point> |
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ama-gi Regular Member
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Qft means "quoted for truth" Last edited on Tue Feb 12th, 2008 04:49 am by ama-gi |
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ama-gi Regular Member
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ama-gi wrote: Qft means "quoted for truth" QFT |
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Comp-tech State Researcher
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TheEggman wrote: 'Implanted chips' is not really tinfoil hat mentality. Some can't see the forrest for the trees...... FDA Clears VeriChip for Medical Applications in the United States... http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2004/Oct/1082567.htm Under-the-skin ID chips move towards U.S. hospitals... http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9584_22-5285815.html Human chips more than skin deep... http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9584_22-5319869.html And, just for you LEO 229....Looks like LEO's might be some of the first ones required to be "chipped"... By JILL BARTON Associated Press April 13, 2004, 4:54 PM EDT PALM BEACH -- A new computer chip promises to keep police guns from firing if they fall into the wrong hands. The tiny chip would be implanted in a police officer's hand and would match up with a scanning device inside a handgun. If the officer and gun match, a digital signal unlocks the trigger so it can be fired. But if a child or criminal would get hold of the gun, it would be useless. The technology is the latest attempt to create a so-called ``smart gun'' and could be marketed to law enforcement agencies within a year, according to Verichip Corp., which has created the microchip. Verichip president Keith Bolton said that the technology could also improve safety for the military and individual gun owners. ``If you let your mind wander to other potential uses, you can imagine the lives that could be saved,'' he said. Verichip, which has marketed similar microchips for security and medical purposes, announced Tuesday a partnership with gun maker FN Manufacturing to produce the smart weapons. The companies have developed a prototype and are working to refine its accuracy, Bolton said. Similar developments are under way at other gun manufacturers and research firms. The New Jersey Institute of Technology and Australian gun maker Metal Storm Ltd. are working on a prototype smart gun that would recognize its owner's individual grip. ``We're at an interesting age where all sorts of science fiction is becoming real technology,'' said Donald Sebastian, NJIT vice president for research and development and director of the project. The technology could also eventually have an even bigger impact on the illegal gun trade, Sebastian said. The FBI estimated that 67 percent of the 16,204 murders in 2002 were committed with firearms. ``You have a long-term benefit of making it much more difficult for a handgun to have any value to anyone other than the original owner,'' Sebastian said. But until the smart-gun technology is repeatedly proved to be reliable, some law enforcement authorities remain leery. The scanning device could malfunction, the officer's hand with the computer chip could be smashed during a fight or an officer might need to use a partner's gun, said West Palm Beach police training Sgt. William Sandman. ``We have power outages, computers crash. Would you risk your life knowing all those things that could go wrong?'' Sandman said. Verichip's Bolton said those concerns already are being addressed. He said the guns can be designed to work for an officer, his partner and a supervisor. Departments could set routines where the scanning devices in guns could be checked before every shift. The chip needs no battery or power source. It works much like those that have been implanted in pets over the past decade so they can be identified if they get lost. Verichip, a subsidiary of the Palm Beach-based technology firm Applied Digital Solutions, developed a ``more intelligent'' version two years ago for humans and estimates that about 900 people worldwide have been implanted with them. The chips can be used instead of security key cards at office buildings or to use global positioning satellites to keep track of a relative who might suffer from Alzheimer's. It can store medical information that emergency rooms could read or financial and identification information to prevent fraud. The chip, about the size of a grain of rice, is inserted into an arm or hand with a syringe _ much like a shot is given. Bolton said the company has seen no medical complications and that the technology will only improve with time. Once the technology is accepted, legislation could follow to encourage the use of smart guns. New Jersey already has passed legislation that will require smart gun technology on all handguns sold _ three years after the state attorney general certifies that smart guns are available in the marketplace. The National Rifle Association opposes the legislation because of potential problems with smart-gun technology, but gun safety advocates argue that the technology could encourage gun ownership with the newfound sense of security. ``It seems that guns are the only product that haven't followed a path of development that leads to greater safety for the user. The only real change we've seen is to make them more lethal and smaller so they can be more easily concealed,'' said Rob Wilcox, a spokesman for the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence. ``This is one of the steps that hasn't been taken and we think this debate is one that needs to take place.'' ___ On the Net: Applied Digital Solutions: http://www.adsx.com FN Manufacturing: http://www.fnmfg.com/ New Jersey Institute of Technology: http://www.njit.edu/ Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence: http://www.bradycenter.org/ National Rifle Association: http://www.nra.org/ Sorry for the long post...I lost the link to the article but had it saved as a ".doc".... Last edited on Tue Feb 12th, 2008 05:45 am by Comp-tech |
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Sage of Seattle Regular Member 
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So, LEO229,A new computer chip promises to keep police guns from firing if they fall into the wrong hands. What size furs will you be ordering?  |
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TheEggman Regular Member
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The tiny chip would be implanted in a police officer's hand and would match up with a scanning device inside a handgun. If the officer and gun match, a digital signal unlocks the trigger so it can be fired. But if a child or criminal would get hold of the gun, it would be useless. And just how long before 'jamming technology' catches up and the bad guys can turn on a transmitter to render the P.D. firearms useless. If a 9 year old can defeat digital encryption and DRM systems on CDs/DVDs it won't be long before a well-funded criminal or terrorist enterprise comes up with the 'black box' to make it happen. Soory - Drifting Off Topic. Egg |
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TheEggman Regular Member
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The tiny chip would be implanted in a police officer's hand and would match up with a scanning device inside a handgun. If the officer and gun match, a digital signal unlocks the trigger so it can be fired. But if a child or criminal would get hold of the gun, it would be useless. And just how long before 'jamming technology' catches up and the bad guys can turn on a transmitter to render the P.D. firearms useless. If a 9 year old can defeat digital encryption and DRM systems on CDs/DVDs it won't be long before a well-funded criminal or terrorist enterprise comes up with the 'black box' to make it happen. Sorry - Drifting Off Topic. Egg |
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sv_libertarian State Researcher 
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I wonder how long it will be until we have to have devices in our vehicles that allow our movements to be tracked real time... I could see it started with boaters "for our safety" of course... or for "homeland security" This whole thing is creepy. |
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LEO 229 Regular Member
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Sage of Seattle wrote: So, LEO229, Fur might be murder.. but if feels so good!!! I have seen rings on the shooter's hand too that did the same thing. This is a rotten idea since you have to hope like hell it will not have any radio interference and the batteries are good when you go to shoot.  We all know that electronic devices will fail at some point. I would hate that time to be when I am about to shoot to save a life. |
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bohdi Regular Member
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sv_libertarian wrote: I wonder how long it will be until we have to have devices in our vehicles that allow our movements to be tracked real time... I could see it started with boaters "for our safety" of course... or for "homeland security" Haven't done much reading on how rental car agencies were using "black boxes" in the cars to record drivers who were speeding and sending them "tickets" have you...no I'm not making that up. |
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Comp-tech State Researcher
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sv_libertarian wrote: I wonder how long it will be until we have to have devices in our vehicles that allow our movements to be tracked real time... I could see it started with boaters "for our safety" of course... or for "homeland security" "Big rigs" have had data recorders for over 15 years and most now have gps tracking.....most autos made within the last 4-5 years have at least some form of data recorder and more than you might think have gps tracking as well. Think along the lines of "OnStar" or "LoJack"......this sort of crap will likely be made mandatory sooner or later. Last edited on Tue Feb 12th, 2008 09:59 pm by Comp-tech |
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IdahoCorsair State Researcher 
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Boise has a serious rash of traffic cams pointed in all four directions down at drivers' faces at over half of the intersections now. Can't see any justification for four cams even if it was for 'traffic control' issues. Nampa (just west of Boise) is now testing a newer technology that scans all License plates the camera "sees", whether driving the same way, opposing or even parked at angles along-side the street... the computer then logs the plate #s to cross reference later with people's testimonies of alleged where-abouts. So if a criminal says he was driving at 1st and Main at midnight in Boise, and the Nampa PD's camera caught his car parked in front of a murder victims house (at elm and 9th) 2 minutes before a 911 call.... so now, they know where you frequent etc at least in the database. |
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Comp-tech State Researcher
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LEO 229 wrote:This is a rotten idea since you have to hope like hell it will not have any radio interference and the batteries are good when you go to shoot. I agree...stupid idea... "We" know this because we have common sense....but, since when has that had an influence on legislature? |
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Sage of Seattle Regular Member
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IdahoCorsair wrote:Boise has a serious rash of traffic cams pointed in all four directions down at drivers' faces at over half of the intersections now. Can't see any justification for four cams even if it was for 'traffic control' issues. It's exceedingly petty, I know, but I have a habit of making obscene gestures at the cameras just out of principle. I wonder how crimes were ever solved before cameras/global tracking/implanted chips? And since England has had the cameras in place for, what... over fifteen years or something like that... maybe we in the US can use those numbers to show the cost effectiveness of them. In other words, that the cost of the cameras outweigh their supposed benefits. On the other hand, we all have access to published statistics about the usefulness of automated ticket cameras and speed limit guidelines and that they do nothing to solve the problems they were initially said they'd do, so why would this be any different? Guess I just answered my own question. |
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AbNo Regular Member
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Oh gods.... Now I get to flex my comm geek muscle.  As far as the "chip" involved, it would be an RFID chip, since those don't need to be powered. RFID chips can be erased with a burst of microwave energy. I'd say 10-15 seconds should suffice, but I don't have any evidence to support that length of time. It doesn't really "erase" the RFID chip, so much as overload it with induced current, and cook it like a CD in a microwave oven. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_frequency_induction RFID chips are powered by induction, but at very low amperage. An 800-watt microwave in the US produces about 533.33...... amps of power. Some of it is lost in the conversion to microwaves, of course, but it's still more than the power amount the chip is used to. Of course, "cooking" an implanted chip in this way would have about the same effect as grabbing a transmitting CB antenna. Quite noticable. With passive RFID's range of ~10cm, however, a chipped bracelet would be much more practical, cheaper, and easier to issue. There might be a bit of crackling, but again, I have nothing to base this on. Unless someone wants to send me a handful of RFID chips to test. It'll be like The Box 'o Truth. Jamming an RFID chip can be done with a handful of parts scavenged out of a cheap stereo, and an antenna made out of a coke can. It wouldn't have much range, but if you know the frequency you are looking for, you can send out a radio signal of a similar frequency(wavelength), at relatively low power, and you've disabled all/most of the RFID chips in a given area. Or permanently activated them, depending on their programming. The frequency is EASILY obtained from either the item's patent information, marketing information, UL listing, or a spectrum analyzer. Though, on a more serious note, jamming and disabling aside, reading and copying an RFID tag is not exactly rocket science. Hells, look at the integrated garage-door openers that come in some cars. You hold the button down on your garage door opener's factory remote, press the record button on your car's opener, and presto! You've just copied a coded radio signal. The same (or very similar technology) can be used to copy the "activation" signal for a LEO's handgun from his RFID chip bracelet, copied, and rebroadcast at any point and time. It should be noted that I pulled most of this out of my sub-small-of-back (sub-SOB) holster, it's 3 am, and I'm tired. It's pretty close to fact, but I pretty much just made it up based on what I know. In short, it's more or less all speculation, but it's educated speculation. If anyone finds any out-right untruths in there, feel free to correct me. Last edited on Wed Feb 13th, 2008 08:11 am by AbNo |
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Comp-tech State Researcher
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AbNo wrote: Oh gods.... Now I get to flex my comm geek muscle. Everything you said is true...to a point. Everything you stated would apply to the "tags" that are put into products like clothes and other comsumer products but, with all due respect intended, I think the technology has "outgrown" your explanations....at least to some degree. Here is a "commercial" chip that boasts a 40 ft range for example.... http://www.motorola.com/business/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=935ce90e3ae95110VgnVCM1000008406b00aRCRD What concerns me, and many others, are the situations like cited below.... RFID for people... http://www.verichipcorp.com/ VeriChip Corp protects more than 1 million infants in 2007... http://www.digitalangel.com/press_details.aspx?F=20080212.htm Another VeriChip subsidiary... http://www.xmark.com/ And one of the the worst scenarios, IMHO.... http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=32572 http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=42058 Notice the dates on the two above articles....one would think they'd likely have it "perfected" by now. I'd also tend to think that an implanted chip would be harder to "nuke" in the microwave...  |
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LEO 229 Regular Member
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I am not sure how many people are going to nuke their body in a microwave.. Those that would go to this extreme will likely fight tooth and nail to not get it implanted to start with. I will not worry about the government trying to lo-jack me until the time comes. I am confident that this would never happen as the people wold never stand for it. Do a count here and see how many would really want it or allow it. ZERO!! Look at how hard it is just to try and get a national ID card...!!! This board is open carry related and this thread has completely shifted to big brother lo-jacking us. We need to stay on track. How many people in here would really want a gun that required electronics to operate for them to be authorized to actually shoot the gun...?? I for one would NOT!! I hope nobody here is buying stock in those companies because they are going to sink!! |
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Tomahawk Regular Member
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LEO 229 wrote: How many people in here would really want a gun that required electronics to operate for them to be authorized to actually shoot the gun...?? I for one would NOT!! It's an example of using technology to take something that works fine and making it more complicated than it needs to be, with no increase in performance to offset the greater risk of failure. It's a terrible idea, unless your objective is to assert control over those who carry these devices. I don't know if it's a human thing or just the West or just the U.S., but people seem to have a fetish for high tech gadgets. I for one don't want a complicated firearm with more failure modes than an old fashioned one like a 1911 or a revolver, and the same goes for my car. |
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Doug Huffman Regular Member
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Re 'microwave', remember diathermy? Either we are equal or we are not. Good people ought to be armed whre they will, with wits and guns and the truth. NRA KMA$$ |
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bohdi Regular Member
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LEO 229 wrote: How many people in here would really want a gun that required electronics to operate for them to be authorized to actually shoot the gun...?? I for one would NOT!! Not so fast. There are advantages to it. As far as the stock sinking, it's only until the government starts buying it  Just wait. |
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LEO 229 Regular Member
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bohdi wrote: LEO 229 wrote:How many people in here would really want a gun that required electronics to operate for them to be authorized to actually shoot the gun...?? I for one would NOT!! Damn.. this could be true... I am going to switch over all my stocks now!! Buy low, sell high!! Too bad I do not believe in the product. |
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bohdi Regular Member
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I just realized what you were talking about (guns requiring electronic authorization to fire) and what I thought you were talking about (guns with rounds that are electrically initiated) are two completely different things. Guess what, I'll agree with your position, I think that it's a bad thing. I also think the potential of electronically initiated rounds can be a good thing. |
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AbNo Regular Member
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Tomahawk wrote:It's an example of using technology to take something that works fine and making it more complicated than it needs to be, with no increase in performance to offset the greater risk of failure. It's a terrible idea... Generally referred to as "over-engineering". Comp-tech wrote: Everything you said is true...to a point. Everything you stated would apply to the "tags" that are put into products like clothes and other comsumer products but, with all due respect intended, I think the technology has "outgrown" your explanations....at least to some degree. True. Though that Motorola most likely uses a larger antenna, and/or higher-powered transponders. It's also not rice-sized like the implanted ones. Comp-tech wrote: Notice the dates on the two above articles....one would think they'd likely have it "perfected" by now. In my previous example (the crackly one), you don't put it IN a microwave, you use something along the lines of a microwave "gun", or beamer to cook the chip. Like I said, you could build one out of parts in a home microwave. You can also use them to light fluorescent light tubes! bohdi wrote: Guess what, I'll agree with your position, I think that it's a bad thing. I also think the potential of electronically initiated rounds can be a good thing. http://www.metalstorm.com/ http://www.metacafe.com/watch/310622/fire_power/ (Though I don't believe the "can't jam" part) Last edited on Wed Feb 13th, 2008 08:37 pm by AbNo |
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TheEggman Regular Member
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Disabling 'Chips.' One of the tools we used in the darkroom was a 'ZeroStat' gun. Essentially it's a peizoelectric device that emits a positive charge when SLOWLY squeezed, and a negative charge when SLOWLY released. The net result is that it dissipates the static charge on film so dust doesn't cling when it goes into the enlarger. If you make the mistake of squeezing too fast and the gun is close to the skin you can get quite a nasty little ZAP. A 'Spark Lighter' from a gas grill has the same effect. One of my techs 'zapped' his digital watch with one and it's now just a bracelet. It's RUMORED that it can have a similar effect on various RFID and LP tags.  NOTE: The mfg warns against trying to take onto an aircraft since there's no way they'll understand what it is. Egg |
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Doug Huffman Regular Member
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Mere rumor. Piezoelectric crystals produce static electricity. |
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Comp-tech State Researcher
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LEO 229 wrote: I am not sure how many people are going to nuke their body in a microwave.. Company’s revenues at the high-end of its previously stated $30-32 million range, a year-over-year increase of 17 percent [size=DELRAY BEACH, FL – January 15, 2008 – VeriChip Corporation (“VeriChip” or the “Company”) (Nasdaq: CHIP), a provider of RFID systems for healthcare and patient-related needs, announced today that it expects revenues for 2007 at the high-end of the Company's previously released guidance of $30-32 million. During the fourth quarter of 2007, the Company continued to experience strong sales of its healthcare security products, specifically its infant protection and wander prevention systems.] |
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swillden Regular Member 
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AbNo wrote: True. Though that Motorola most likely uses a larger antenna, and/or higher-powered transponders. It's also not rice-sized like the implanted ones.Higher-powered transcievers in the "reader", and larger antenna, and lower operating voltage. To get those long ranges you have to do all three. The larger antenna has another effect, though: The larger antenna means that for a given field strength a larger potential is induced. Couple that with the low operating voltage (and, hence, low design voltage) and it's clear why the long-range tags are much easier to burn out than the short-range tags. AbNo wrote: In my previous example (the crackly one), you don't put it IN a microwave, you use something along the lines of a microwave "gun", or beamer to cook the chip. You can use a microwave oven, too. You have to modify it so that it'll run with the door open. Since it takes less than a second for a typical oven to burn out a typical tag, you'd just set the timer for 1-2 seconds, put the body part from the tag right in front of the open door and hit "Start". You won't get enough tissue heating in such a short time to do any damage -- probably not even enough to feel it -- but the tag will be history. Or, better yet, just refuse to let someone implant it in you in the first place. The funniest application of implanted tags I've heard of to date is a few tourist towns in Spain. Lots of Brits like to vacation in Spain, and many of them "vacation" by going on a 2-3 week bender. For about $50 they can get a chip implanted in their shoulder, and all of the bars have readers and can charge drinks to the account associated with the chip ID. The attraction for the tourists is that they can stagger from bar to bar for days without having to keep track of their wallet. The issue isn't even so much about the worry that their wallet might be stolen, it's just the convenience of not having to worry about it, and being able to easily pay for more drinks when you're too drunk to be able to fish your wallet out of your pocket. |
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swillden Regular Member
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Doug Huffman wrote: Mere rumor. Piezoelectric crystals produce static electricity. Static electricity is very effective at burning out electronics. |
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AbNo Regular Member
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swillden wrote:Static electricity is very effective at burning out electronics. Exactly. Try not wearing an anti-static wrist band in a computer repair class, and see how long it takes before you get tossed out. swillden wrote: AbNo wrote:True. Though that Motorola most likely uses a larger antenna, and/or higher-powered transponders. It's also not rice-sized like the implanted ones.Higher-powered transcievers in the "reader", and larger antenna, and lower operating voltage. To get those long ranges you have to do all three. I wasn't talking about burning out a chip in YOU, I'm talking about killing a chip in an unwitting "victim". |
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ijusam Regular Member 
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Wright tired to escape but thanks to an OnStar device he didn't get very far, police said. "OnStar was able to tell us where the vehicle was. Our state police helicopter got involved, located the vehicle in Pennsylvania and worked with state police to give them a location for the vehicle," Bushweller said http://www.wcsh6.com/news/national/article.aspx?storyid=80646 |
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LEO 229 Regular Member
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We started out chatting about CHP holders and the FBI having their prints on file.... how to defeat the government RFID chipping citizens.... to the the police catching a criminal in a stolen vehicle where the owner elected to subscribe to OnStar service. Please keep it gun related. Last edited on Thu Feb 14th, 2008 12:16 pm by LEO 229 |
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Doug Huffman Regular Member
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I think that everyone here is comfortable with the owner's/administrtors'/modertors' opinions on topicality. |
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TheEggman Regular Member
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Doug Huffman wrote: Mere rumor. Piezoelectric crystals produce static electricity.And could you please explain the relevance of this? An electrical arc, regardless of the source can cook a microchip and many inductive circuits. After all, lightning is just 'static' electricity and a lot of RFID tags use inductive circuits for power. If you think it's a rumor why not take a peizo ignitor and zap a nice, expensive digital watch, or perhaps any random chip in your computer with it and see if it doesn't do damage. BTW, ZeroStat guns DO work. I don't just play an engineer on the Internet, 'I are one.' E |
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Doug Huffman Regular Member
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Because 'it' can happen doesn't mean that it must. I don't just play engineer on the 'net, I retired as one in real life. This is the link to a different public shipyard than mine, closed by BRAC03, but my division. http://www.nnsy1.navy.mil/DeptLinks/test_division.htm I physically (chainfalls, soldering iron and time domain reflectometer) installed a first back-fit micro-electronic reactor instrumentation system. I physically built custom temperature compensating diodes. Either we are equal or we are not. Good people ought to be armed where they will, with wits and guns and the truth. NRA KMA$$ |
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swillden Regular Member
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AbNo wrote: I wasn't talking about burning out a chip in YOU, I'm talking about killing a chip in an unwitting "victim". Ah, right. Sorry, missed that. Yeah, that would also be easy. If you employed a little tactical care you could even do it without the "victim" knowing you did it. A smart mass murderer could even hide small transmitters near each entry to his target area, ensuring that when the cops arrived all their weapons would be non-functional. Nice. |
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